[LM24] Le Mans 2023 Le Mans Entries (Closed)

[kartman24]

Well this years race has been and gone and hopefully we can look forward to a much greater depth of competition in the top class in the next few years. What do we reckon next years Hypercar class entry list will comprise of? I will kick it off, if anyone has more info on the likely entries please speak up!

2 Toyotas
2 Glickenhaus
2 Peugeots
2/4 Porsche
2 Ferrari
2/4 Cadillac
Acura?
BMW?

[tomcug]

Originally Posted by kartman24

2 Glickenhaus

Not sure if James still wants to continue after another "fair" BOP this year (and it's probably gonna get worse once more big boys join).

Originally Posted by kartman24

2/4 Porsche
2/4 Cadillac

Most likely 2 cars each of these two.

Originally Posted by kartman24

Acura?
BMW?

Not in 2023.

[broadrun96]

Think they'll be some words between the ACO and Jim but I could see them back again with someone new bringing their cars, sounds like they're talking with others about more money and sales. And I would expect the GT3 car to be run by someone

BMW and Acura are out until, or if, they sell a car or 2.

Porsche I think will try to get 3 cars, as will Toyota just to up the odds

Caddy and Peugeot will run their 2 cars, Ferrari likely only the 2 chassis built by then.

Taking the dropped cars of GTE-Pro (7 cars) and possible lost Am cars in the last year and possible P2 losses (Penske, AF Corse at least), I think we'll have 10 "open spaces" vs this year. And the ACO will add their premier cars for the 100 anniversary over more GT cars

[canaglia]

Originally Posted by kartman24

Well this years race has been and gone and hopefully we can look forward to a much greater depth of competition in the top class in the next few years. What do we reckon next years Hypercar class entry list will comprise of? I will kick it off, if anyone has more info on the likely entries please speak up!

2 Toyotas
2 Glickenhaus
2 Peugeots
2/4 Porsche
2 Ferrari
2/4 Cadillac
Acura?
BMW?

(more or less) confirmed 2023 WEC entries



2x toyota
2x ferrari
2x peugeot
2x porsche
1x cadillac



it's difficult to tell by now if glickenhaus will be at LM with one or two cars. Acura already confirmed that WTR and MSR won't be at le mans next year. Alpine and lamborghini will debut in 2024.
Rumored BMW WRT is a big question mark by now, but that's another probably 2024 entry for what is being told at the moment.
GM stated they're going to have at least 2 cars in IMSA and 1 full season WEC.
Private porsche lmdh for 2023 is a little too much optimistic IMHO.

[Simmi]

Somewhere between 10 and 12 feels about right and then it will explode in '24. Pushing 30 cars I reckon.

Like broadrun96 referenced, I do wonder when the 3rd works cars will come in. With entry lists getting tighter perhaps teams will need to commit to full or partial seasons with any additional cars? And I think we'll see some extremely thinly veiled 'customer' teams.

[joeb]

Originally Posted by Simmi

Somewhere between 10 and 12 feels about right and then it will explode in '24. Pushing 30 cars I reckon.

Like broadrun96 referenced, I do wonder when the 3rd works cars will come in. With entry lists getting tighter perhaps teams will need to commit to full or partial seasons with any additional cars? And I think we'll see some extremely thinly veiled 'customer' teams.

What would a required full season WEC entry do for entries in the other classes though? would there be much room?

[Simmi]

Originally Posted by joeb

What would a required full season WEC entry do for entries in the other classes though? would there be much room?

I think it's going to be a big issue for them going forward if they are still capped. To the point that any tracks that can't support more could be dropped. That's just a guess. I think Fuji is the main issue but Toyota's bargaining power will diminish with so many other manufacturers in the paddock.

That said I don't think it will be the top class that suffers if/when tough entry decisions need to be made.

[broadrun96]

Originally Posted by joeb

What would a required full season WEC entry do for entries in the other classes though? would there be much room?

Well all 62 don't run the full season so there's space to add LM only cars. Have to assume outside of the IMSA and AsLMS auto invites most of the remaining at-large (for lack of a better term) would be Hypercar/GTP cars. Gotta make it look good for future manufacturers and promote we will make space for you

[Michel Vaillant]

Why nobody expected Vanwall/Kolles ? :mrgreen:

[Coach Ep]

Originally Posted by broadrun96

Think they'll be some words between the ACO and Jim but I could see them back again with someone new bringing their cars, sounds like they're talking with others about more money and sales. And I would expect the GT3 car to be run by someone

BMW and Acura are out until, or if, they sell a car or 2.

Porsche I think will try to get 3 cars, as will Toyota just to up the odds

Caddy and Peugeot will run their 2 cars, Ferrari likely only the 2 chassis built by then.

Taking the dropped cars of GTE-Pro (7 cars) and possible lost Am cars in the last year and possible P2 losses (Penske, AF Corse at least), I think we'll have 10 "open spaces" vs this year. And the ACO will add their premier cars for the 100 anniversary over more GT cars

By that same token, I'd fully expect a 3rd Pug as well - and perhaps Ferrari. And a 4th Porsche is certainly not out of the question, there's only one Centennial every 100 years after all (well two since the 100th edition will be further down the road. )

Edit: if we are to include 2 Glickenhaus cars, 2 Caddys and a surprise Beamer, the possible total would come to 18 (4 Porsches + 3 Toyotas + 3 Peugeots + 3 Ferraris + 2 + 2 +1). All the ACO has to do is eliminate 6 P2s and/or GTs and we're set. Should be rather straightforward for the selection committee.

[canaglia]

Originally Posted by Coach Ep

total would come to 18 (4 Porsches + 3 Toyotas + 3 Peugeots + 3 Ferraris + 2 + 2 +1).

Is this a 2023 prediction? Optimism here is over 9000.

[S griffin]

I think we should hopefully get the number of hypercars into double figures. There’s enough noises from manufacturers to suggest this

[Coach Ep]

There might also be a privateer or two who are getting their hands a Porsche LMDh, Proton is certainly in the mix and perhaps DragonSpeed? Or United?

[broadrun96]

Originally Posted by Coach Ep

There might also be a privateer or two who are getting their hands a Porsche LMDh, Proton is certainly in the mix and perhaps DragonSpeed? Or United?

I thought Porsche said they wouldn't have any customer cars until 2024 with having to make the 4 cars plus spares of the factory program. I would definitely expect Proton to get at least 1 car at some point.

Dragonspeed or United I would expect to try to get other cars with more support, Graham made it sound like there's at least one more ready to announce soon and another ready to confirm they're in process.

But I'm on your side with optimism and extra cars. Not sure about BMW though, feels like an IMSA only cost saving attempt.

[canaglia]

Originally Posted by S griffin

I think we should hopefully get the number of hypercars into double figures. There’s enough noises from manufacturers to suggest this

Speaking for 2023 I think reaching double figures is all about on what glickenhaus is going to do, 8 cars entries are quite solid (ferrari, peugeot, toyota and porsche).

+ 1 WEC car by cadillac according to actual GM statement and to me it's unlikely to see a second one considering they should deliver it from detroit to france to then bring it back to USA for WG, taking risk of that car getting damaged or written off during the race. A second cadillac I can see it happen only if dallara would produce one or two extra chassis for 2023.

Third car for ferrari, peugeot and toyota is too early, only toyota has shown a little interest for a third car to let ogier running at LM. In my opinion we won't see third cars at all because of cost saving policy and most important because none of them will give a car full of confidential technologies to a private team, even if officially backed.

During barcelona tests porsche stated that they didn't decide yet if they're going to bring or not IMSA cars to LM as well, but at the same time they also stated that having more than 2 cars wasn't exactly their priority, and just like cadillac, I see it unlikely for the same logistical reasons.

The only one left is glickenhaus, but unlike 2021 and 2022, next year will be quite harder for them getting a chance to the podium, his involvment in 2023 LM is basically impossible to predict at the moment.

The rumored BMW WRT seems like a 2024 program.

So, my 2023 prediction

(solid entries)
2x ferrari
2x peugeot
2x WEC porsche penske
2x toyota
1x WEC cadillac cgr

(potential but unconfirmed entries)
1-2x glickenhaus

(unlikely entries)
+1x IMSA cadillac cgr
+2x IMSA porsche penske

+1x BMW WRT


(way more unlikely entries)
+1x third toyota
+1x kolles HyPeRcAr

[kdr]

Curious. If BMW and Acura running teams are only in IMSA at the time, does this preclude them from submitting an application to enter LM 2023 to the ACO?

[S griffin]

I'm sure it won't matter too much for BMW, their main priority at the moment is returning to Le Mans. Acura seem more involved in IMSA than BMW are IMHO

[Michel Vaillant]

I think there will be a Kolles HyperCar. That was the plan, and the car is already built…

[tux]

Hope so Michel Vaillant but lets be honest, you wouldn't want to bet your house on it. Car was testing on track in April so you would hope if they can sort out the naming issues then they'd appear. Doubt they'd get a place at Le Mans though IF the ACO needs a space for a manufacturer entry.

[Simmi]

Originally Posted by kdr

Curious. If BMW and Acura running teams are only in IMSA at the time, does this preclude them from submitting an application to enter LM 2023 to the ACO?

I think they can try and enter. But it will be quickly batted back by the ACO.

I think the second IMSA Cadillac would be looked on favourably as they'll already have that WEC presence.

[S griffin]

I don’t see why they shouldn’t be allowed to enter. The ACO maybe needs to come to some agreement

Would love to see Cadillac back at Le Mans, we’ve seen how well they’ve done in IMSA and they definitely would be a great addition at Le Mans if they entered in the Hyperclass

[canaglia]

Originally Posted by S griffin

I don’t see why they shouldn’t be allowed to enter. The ACO maybe needs to come to some agreement

"it's not about money it's about sending a message"


if ACO lets acura teams enter LM, in future many other teams will be asking to enter LM without getting involved in WEC.

[broadrun96]

Well The Captain says hold you horses guys, sounds like Porsche is keen for all 4 and he is not.

https://sportscar365.com/lemans/wec/...mans-unlikely/

But Porsche does make it sound like they could have 2 Penske and 2 customer cars for Daytona so......

[Coach Ep]

Originally Posted by broadrun96

Well The Captain says hold you horses guys, sounds like Porsche is keen for all 4 and he is not.

https://sportscar365.com/lemans/wec/...mans-unlikely/

But Porsche does make it sound like they could have 2 Penske and 2 customer cars for Daytona so......

Article is pretty clear up till the last paragraph when it instantly becomes another head scratcher! Right now, I'm just gonna go with 2 factory cars and anything on top of that (factory or privateer) is a real bonus!

[broadrun96]

Originally Posted by Coach Ep

Article is pretty clear up till the last paragraph when it instantly becomes another head scratcher! Right now, I'm just gonna go with 2 factory cars and anything on top of that (factory or privateer) is a real bonus!

Hey, we will not tolerate that type of optimistic no doom and gloom attitude here sir.