Does F1 need more STREET circuits??

[ralf fan]

does F1 need more street races like Monaco and Canada?? ofcourse they have produced some great Gp's over the past few years but tracks like Malaysia give more chance for overtaking.
so simple enough question..

[neilap]

Canada is an unusual street cirtuit. Most of the street circuits fall more into the category on Monaco. I dislike them.

[Sodemo]

But tracks like Maylasia don't always offer more overtaking.
I must be one of the few F1 fans that hates the Sepang circuit.

I do think we could do with a few more street circuits.

[jj2728]

i don't think canada falls into the category of a street circuit and monaco remains on the calender because of its history, the fact that it is the showcase for sponsors, and that it is....well....monaco....i think that if f1 had any more street circuits, they should follow the australian example.....

[Snrub]

The Montreal race certainly isn't what comes to mind when one thinks of a street circuit. For all intensive purposes it's a typical road course.

F1 needs more tracks that are more condusive to F1 passing. Also, natural terrain road courses need to make a comeback.

[Knowlesy]

It would be nice to see more street circuits but not in the Monaco mould. I'm thinking of Adelaide type tracks.
And not too many either, otherwise they lose their unique tag.

[steve nielsen]

we need more tracks with challenging corners, and those are usualy not found on street tracks.

[santori]

Not need but I would like to see Montjuich Park or Pau on the calender. Dreaming, just dreaming....

[esorniloc]

Depends on what is ment by a `street circuit'.

In cart for example it is very confusing. :confused:

Some people there regard any temp circuit as a street circuit (eg Cleveland - what is that circuit?) :confused:

[GTRMagic]

Can Australia have a 2nd round, and have the F1 take the ChampCar round date on the Surfer's Paradise circuit??

I dont see why not

[crozier74]

I voted "Yeah Yeah Yeah!!". I think that it's always a good thing to have variety in the type of circuits which are raced on by a series, and I think F1 should try and showcase the very best of all kinds of circuits in equal measure. For me the street circuit races have a much greater sense of occasion about them, so for sure there should be more than just one temporary one (Monte Carlo) and two semi-permanent ones (Albert Park, Montreal). But it's essential to get the balance right with the circuit, you can have greats like Macau, but then ****ers like Miami. What about the following for F1 races, as all currently exist/have been proposed to a decent standard:

Bilbao, Spain
Cagliari, Italy
Changwon, South Korea
Guia, Macau
Long Beach, USA
Monte Carlo, Monaco
Pau, France
Surfers Paradise, Australia
Vienna, Austria

[Mr V]

Would love to see Adelaide back on the calender. But circuits like Monaco, no ta!

[twig]

If we were to see more street circuits, i would far prefer them to be added on to the current season, and not replace a normal circuit.

So if we had the option of having 16 races - like now --- Or having 16 races PLUS 4 more street circuits - then i would far prefer the latter.

[pirenzo]

Originally posted by ralf fan
does F1 need more street races like Monaco and Canada?? ofcourse they have produced some great Gp's over the past few years but tracks like Malaysia give more chance for overtaking.
so simple enough question..

Just to echo The Monster's thoughts, just how much overtaking have you seen at Sepang? (not including wet races, they don't count)
If you ever pop into Armchair Enthusiast, you'll see a thread with more than 4000 posts called "My Tracks". We frequently have this debate of how much overtaking these modern super tracks offer.
Race track design is more of an art than you might think. It's very difficult to engineer into a new track overtaking spots. I would argue it's nearly impossible to judge the correct corner combinations that will allow passing. A tight corner at the end of a long straight is not an answer. Look at Monza's first corner if you want proof of how inneficient this is.

So my thought would be that street tracks can add variety. They can also be mindless series of right angle bends.

I think what is important is to have more circuits. It's no good pouring all our efforts into these souless showpieces of contemporary architecture, where the circuit is to it's facilites as a parking lot is to a cinema. We're just gonna end up with a single big facility per country, and all the real venues like Brands are gonna go. And that will be sad. Since we cannot build lots more race tracks, it makes sense to have a few more semi permanent street tracks to supplement what we have already.

[Jay]

Canada is a street circuit as far as the driving is concerned, and it is a regular road the rest of the year (apart from the 3 days it's used for the CART race as well). The reason most people don't see it as a street circuit is that most of it is boardered by a few feet of grass and there are small gravel traps in places - other than that, it's just a fairly flat (there are elevation changes - but you have to walk the track to see them) street circuit.

I think F1 could use more street circuits to provide more variety in the circuits. Some drivers really like the street circuits as well, becuase the sensation of speed between the concrete walls is much greater than when the tire walls are 200 feet away (like Nurburgring).

I don't think F1 will go to any more street circuits though, as they are insistent on having elaborate permenant facilities that cannot be found at many street circuits. They've been making an exception for Monaco, because it is Monaco (though they're building some better facilities from what I hear) and Montreal has its own permenant facilities; however, I don't think the F1 snobs would be able to tolerate the cramped and temporary facilities they would find at most street circuits such as Surfers Paradise, Long Beach, etc.

[jj2728]

Originally posted by pirenzo
So my thought would be that street tracks can add variety. They can also be mindless series of right angle bends.

phoenix 1991 springs to mind....

[Smokey 6 litre]

i'd like to see a fast street curcuit.

[MacMan]

Originally posted by jj2728
phoenix 1991 springs to mind....

this one and Detroit spring to my mind.
I often drive Phoenix on F1 2002 in the 2003 cars and it is great fun.
Plus who could forget Senna and Alesi there
so I voted for ore street tracks

and I wish they would swap back to Adelaide and dump Melbourne

[santori]

Originally posted by Smokey 6 litre
i'd like to see a fast street curcuit.

Montjuich Park. That must have been extraordinary. Too dangerous but....
It seems a shame that such an interesting city as Barcelona has such a bland, if well-organized, GP as it does.

[ASCII Man]

Originally posted by jj2728
phoenix 1991 springs to mind....

Originally posted by MacMan
this one and Detroit spring to my mind.
I often drive Phoenix on F1 2002 in the 2003 cars and it is great fun.
Plus who could forget Senna and Alesi there
so I voted for ore street tracks

and I wish they would swap back to Adelaide and dump Melbourne

Hmmmm...
I think that should be Phoenix 1990
Alesi was driving for Ferrari in 1991.

[santori]

I did hear a rumour a while ago that there were tentative plans for a street circuit in Cape Town. Camps Bay, I think. That could have been very good - elavation changes - but the collapse of the rand probably finished it.

[BootsOntheSide]

Canada isn't a typical street circuit for two reasons - partly, the gravel traps around it give it a more typical feel. Secondly, unlike more 'street' circuits, the layout is actually designed for racing, and produces exciting races almost every year.

Most street circuits from the modern era are boring, soulless offering. The predominance of them in the US is probably the main reason the Americans lost interest in F1 in the 1980s, adn teh large amount on the current ChampCar schedule is surely a amjor reason for the problems that series has had in attracting an audience.

Sepang is a circuit I like, as I've always found it challenging, it flows well, adn great races seem to gravitate there. The weather has an effect, but that's part of the fun of having a racetrack in Malaysia.

A lot of the modern circuits are quite lame, especially Hungaroring, Catalunya and the redesigned Hockenheimring. The series is too obsessed with safety, which has now gone OTT. As long as there are big run-off areas at the fast corners, the classic tracks ar eno mroe dangerous than those. Features of the cars, such as impact protection, shielded fuel tanks and rollover hoops, have a much bigger effect.

The changes to Monaco this year, moving the barriers out at some of the toughest corners and instantly nullifying half the challenge of the ultimate driving test, are a particular disgrace. The top teams shouldn't be monopolising the track the way they did this year.

[pirenzo]

We need Monjuich and London on the Calender

[mansellmania]

Originally posted by pirenzo

Race track design is more of an art than you might think. It's very difficult to engineer into a new track overtaking spots. I would argue it's nearly impossible to judge the correct corner combinations that will allow passing. A tight corner at the end of a long straight is not an answer. Look at Monza's first corner if you want proof of how inneficient this is.

They can also be mindless series of right angle bends.

I think what is important is to have more circuits. It's no good pouring all our efforts into these souless showpieces of contemporary architecture, where the circuit is to it's facilites as a parking lot is to a cinema. We're just gonna end up with a single big facility per country, and all the real venues like Brands are gonna go. And that will be sad. Since we cannot build lots more race tracks, it makes sense to have a few more semi permanent street tracks to supplement what we have already.

I was kinda baffled when they switched from that superb adelaide track to that park in melbourne.
That backstraight was really nice for overtaking.. recall alesi doing some crazy stuff.
Perhaps the t1 at monza isnt perfect but wasnt that because it is a chicane rather than corner?

Further the overtaking we saw at the british gp was largely due to the increasing tyrewar is what barrichello said after the race.
Silverstone isnt known for overtaking heaven since they killed a few great corners after 94, yet the race was great.

I'm a big fan of the tyrewar and think that is also important factor aside the track lay-out.