NASCAR slowing the cars/tries to break up the 2-car tandems at Daytona

[rustyfan]

As expected NASCAR wasn't too happy seeing the 206 mph-speeds, so they have just mandated some changes to slow the cars down. Not by traditional means, like going to a different restrictor plate, however:

Originally Posted by NASCAR.com

NASCAR issued a bulletin Sunday that attempts to equate the four manufacturers' ability to control their engines' water temperatures. At the same time, it continues trying to limit their ability to engage in speed-building two-car drafts.

--//--

"What they're looking to do is put an external pressure-relief valve [near] the top of the water [overflow] tank," Gilmore said, explaining that the bulletin mandated set-diameter hoses to and from the tank and a pressure-relief valve supplied by NASCAR and set to 33 PSI.

In addition, the bulletin mandated a change to rule book section 20-7.3, whereby, no matter the shape of the grille, per manufacturer identity, it would have an aluminum plate behind with a rectangular opening with a 50-square-inch maximum opening for cooling.

(Source)

They're hoping the changes will stop the cars from being able to push another car for 10-12 laps and force them to get out of line after just a few laps, basically like we saw at the RP tracks last year. Guess we'll see come Thursday if it works.

[fieldodreams79]

I don't think making the cars overheat is the best way to "slow" them down, but what do I know?



NASCAR is run by a bunch of apes.

[beachbum]

Originally Posted by fieldodreams79

I don't think making the cars overheat is the best way to "slow" them down, but what do I know?



NASCAR is run by a bunch of apes.

Now the "pusher" will just duck out and grab some air, and since they won't be pushing in line, possibly cause some spins like happened in the shootout. The switch overs (pusher to pushee) will be a mess as well. It won't stop the 2 car drafts because the speed gained is just so large. And this is the "have at it boys" series?

[rustyfan]

Originally Posted by fieldodreams79

I don't think making the cars overheat is the best way to "slow" them down, but what do I know?

NASCAR is run by a bunch of apes.

At least it's better than going to a smaller restrictor plate and decreasing the throttle response, IMHO.

[fieldodreams79]

For a 500 mile race, to slow cars by making them run hot is idiotic.

Plates were a temporary fix more than 20 years ago and this is the best they can come up with?

[broadrun96]

And somehow a simpler solution like a smaller fuel flow is outside the realm of consideration? Seems like anything would be better than inducing more drivers to push the limits and risk causing the big one, or is bunching the cars up again the goal of NASCAR. I just keep thinking something has to be actually tested, even if it means smaller carbs or injectors would be more safe and raceable than overheating the engines to break up drafting.

[picchiofan]

Originally Posted by broadrun96

And somehow a simpler solution like a smaller fuel flow is outside the realm of consideration? Seems like anything would be better than inducing more drivers to push the limits and risk causing the big one, or is bunching the cars up again the goal of NASCAR. I just keep thinking something has to be actually tested, even if it means smaller carbs or injectors would be more safe and raceable than overheating the engines to break up drafting.

The new pavement is so grippy that everyone can just cling to the bottom line and no one can pass on the outside. The two car "trains" look to be risky, and will get old to watch pretty quickly. This idea seems to make sense in that it forces the drivers to move around more. Simply going to a smaller restrictor would be horrible, watch the ARCA race from Saturday and see how boring that race was with single file lines clung to the bottom, no one could ever pull out to pass, even with a draft.

[fieldodreams79]

I didn't watch the ARCA race and I am NOT trying to discredit it, just asking a question; how much can we compare an ARCA car to the CoT at a plate track?

I agree that smaller plates and one line on the bottom for 200 laps would be awful. I just don't see how these neanderthals are essentially "throwing darts" at a package less than a week from the green flag their "Crown Jewel", new pavement or not.

[PabloTeK]

Being that these drivers earn many millions of dollars to drive the cars, surely they could be trusted not to cause a massive accident? If I paid my driver as much as the #48 gets then I'd expect them to know when enough is enough. NASCAR needs to stop fiddling and let the drivers work it out themselves...

[NaBUru38]

If they had tried less banking in the inside lane...

[fieldodreams79]

Originally Posted by NaBUru38

If they had tried less banking in the inside lane...

That was another thought I had; they blew a great opportunity to make some slight changes to the banking before repaving, but that would change the "historic nature" of the speedway and perhaps be out of line with the budget.

I could be overreacting, but I guess we'll find out Thursday.

[picchiofan]

Originally Posted by NaBUru38

If they had tried less banking in the inside lane...

No, please. They already f'd up Bristol, Vegas is terrible. No more gimmicky multiple banking tracks.

[gttouring]

They could just raise the car I guess more drag ... that might help and itmight slow corner speed s

[Purist]

So, now we KNOW that the "Big One" WILL be caused by somebody checking up because somebody blows an engine and sends a smoke/steam cloud back into the midst of the pack. Wonderful! And, this race will have the worst mechanical attrition seen in the series for decades.

And with all the turbulence from side drafts, and just the other cars in the pack, no such pressure-relief valve will be able to function anything like as intended, I don't think. Either it'll be sprung too stiff to have any effect, or it'll be too easily opened by the external low pressure and pressure shifts, which will cause the cars to just start watering the track once they're up near race speed.

It's a recipe for disaster, period!

[gttouring]

Its funny really did they base this idea on the bud shootout? It only had half the cars and mandatory stops...what a bone head move, the cars are safe to go 200 and crash- the fence might not be

[Purist]

The cars are safe to go 210-215mph and crash, as we've seen from qualifying and races at Fontana and Michigan.

[MJ_N_09]

At this rate, more cars will be taken out by engine failures, than the big one.

[rustyfan]

I think there is a bit of overreacting going on in regards to the changes made - the only way the drivers will overheat their engines is if they insist on doing the push for more than 3-4 laps like they did in the Shootout where they could go 10-12 laps without problem (much thanks to the new cooling systems the teams had developed themselves).

If they limit themselves to pushing for just a few laps - like at the plate tracks last year - and race like "normal" in a big pack the engines should be fine.

(And just because I've written the above we'll probably see engines poppin' left and right )

Anyway, they'll have some time to test the changes in practice tomorrow and during the Duels on Thursday. So no reason to panic yet.

Originally Posted by PabloTeK

Being that these drivers earn many millions of dollars to drive the cars, surely they could be trusted not to cause a massive accident?

One would think that, but... no

[DavyC412]

the race is going to be 200 laps though, having to change every 10 laps or so means theyll still have to swap about 20 times during the race, no counting when they switch drafting partners, go in for pit stops etc etc.

tbh the bud shootout was one of the most interesting nascar races ive seen, to go back to the "normal" way of racing would suck hard.

[JHamilton]

I've been *****ing about this for years to field. Smaller engines at Daytona and 'Dega. Let's say a max of 302 or 305 ci. May the best engine builder win.

[DavyC412]

Originally Posted by JHamilton

I've been *****ing about this for years to field. Smaller engines at Daytona and 'Dega. Let's say a max of 302 or 305 ci. May the best engine builder win.

then what happens when toyota wins everything?

[JHamilton]

Originally Posted by DavyC412

then what happens when toyota wins everything?

Then they win everything.

[Purist]

Which isn't how racing can work in this TV/media age, unfortunately. A series just won't survive with a dominant manufacturer.

Besides, as GT racing has shown, a 4.0-litre V8 can produce the power levels these cars make with the restrictor plates in place, and those endurance racing engines have to be able to last a heck of a lot longer.

Maybe we just need a reproduction run of Charger Daytonas and Roadrunner Superbirds for Daytona and Talladega.

[rustyfan]

NASCAR has decided to give finding a solution to the two-car tandem another go. Last time, as you may recall, they tried limiting the drafting by forcing the cars to run hot, which in theory would force the drivers to back off and thus breaking up the two-car tandems.

As it turns out the teams took it as a challenge and developed better cooling systems, keeping the two-car tandem style of racing alive.

So what has NASCAR decided to try this time around, after the overheating trick didn't pan out? Well... more or less the same thing:

Originally Posted by Autosport.com

NASCAR makes further attempt to limit two-car drafts at Talladega

NASCAR has announced technical changes ahead of next month's Chase race at Talladega in an attempt to limit the tandem racing that has prevailed this year at restrictor-plate tracks.

Drivers will have available up to 10 horsepower more relative to the last time they raced at the 2.66-mile oval in the spring, after NASCAR decided to increase the size of the restrictor-plate opening by 1/64th of an inch up to 57/64ths.

Additionally, the relief valve on the car's cooling system will be re-calibrated to reduce pressure by around eight pounds per square inch, which should prevent engines from running on the edge of the temperature gauges for as long as before.

Will be interesting to see how it pans out and I for one wouldn't mind NASCAR being successful in decreasing the amount of two-car tandem drafting - nor would Dale Jr.

Originally Posted by Autosport.com / Dale Earnhardt Jr.

"Over the long haul, it's not the best," Earnhardt said at the time. "It is not as good as 40 dudes in one pack racing like hell trying to get to the front. It is nowhere near as good as that. Give me that any day over this...

"People will realise it and go 'Yeah, ok.' The novelty of this... once the newnews of all this wears off, how interesting this is and how unique it is wears off, I think that people will start to see."

[Clive Brown]

This is all re-arranging the deckchairs on the Titanic. At the heart of the problem lies the immutable fact that neither Daytona nor Talladega is fit for Sprint Cup cars; with restrictor plates, both circuits are flat out all the way round, so that any muppet (no matter how unskilled) can run at the front. Smaller unrestricted engines are no answer; they'd still be flat out.

NASCAR should withdraw their sanction until such time as both tracks have sufficient measures in place to allow unrestricted racing, but of course, the incestuous relationship between the sanctioning body and the circuit owner means that this will never happen. Daytona could at least run events using the infield section to reduce speeds for 780 bhp cars, but there is no obvious solution for Talladega.

Until the turns once more become a challenge for drivers, nothing will change....