New Arrive and drive series(?)

[Mach3]

I know there's been a few posts about this sort of thing before, so thought it might be of interest that Club MotorSport Vision is proposing a new club racing series according to this weeks' Autosport (page 93).

I did some digging, as I have just bought an BMW E30 as a trackday car and was interested to see what they had planned - link is http://www.clubmsv.com/car-home/news...sv-racing.aspx.

Apparently they're looking at hour long races for £400...

[Al Weyman]

I wonder what this reminds you of, sounds a bit like Future Classics and catch alls like that, is there really enough room for any more? Does not appeal massively to me as I think a set of regs is desirable but can see some attraction and may at least encourage some Trackdayers to have a race or two.

[nik]

im all for it and will support them fully, with backing to help make that series happen

[Tim Falce]

The trouble with MSV is that they will be a catch all promoter and as such it will end up with a grid of mixed cars of Peugeots, Citroens, Golf GTIs, BMWs etc with a scattering of Caterfields and Radicals and the odd Jade chucked in here and there. The speed differential will be too great, as I found out to my cost on their first ever race, and accidents will happen and people will be put off.

[andy97]

I suppose that the CSCC should be flattered that other organisations are copying the concept but these sorts of races already exist with the CSCC's "Tin Tops" and "Future Classics" Series and are also novice friendly.

[Al Weyman]

Erm I wonder, same as I was 'flattered' the first time we took ModProds to Combe, they liked it so much they never invited us back and promptly started their own version with almost identical regs coaxing over about 20% or more of our drivers in the process, same happened when we went to Lydden they started their own version but at least the guy organising it had the politeness to phone me up and ask my permission to use the regs! Now where have I heard this recently?

[Tim Wilkinson]

Originally Posted by Al Weyman

may at least encourage some Trackdayers to have a race or two.

Personally I doubt the concept will have much effect, any take-up is likely to come because it's MSV and they're a known name in trackday-land, where a lot (all?) of the motorsport clubs aren't.

In my view what stops trackdayers having an occasional race is the cost of making that step to racing. It's two-fold - the cost of prepping a safe track / road car to "race" standards e.g. extinguisher, cut-offs, dated harnesses, helmet and race-suit, timing equipment; and the personal costs - medical costs, about £300 to do the ARDs, £50 a year for a license. And it goes on....

How many would want to shell out that much money for one or two races? Plus the blue-book is a bloody shambles, so you're never sure whether your car is truly legal, or whether the 3-year old twice used helmet you've got is going to be outlawed next year.


As a trackdayer I took the plunge a few years ago, but haven't raced as much as I've wanted - the new series would interest me if it wasn't hour long race. I doubt the fuel tank would hold that much!

CSCC Tintops would be fine for me, but doesn't allow carbs where injection was standard, does it? Same applies to pre-93s - is that a recent rule-change, as i'm sure original regs allowed that swap.

Overall, this is one step to getting trackdayers involved, but it's a drop in the ocean to making motorsport more accessible and popular. The whole organisation structure needs overhauling, in my opinion. What I'd like to see is MSV rivalling the MSA - start from scratch with a minimal set of "catch-all" championships, properly promoted at circuits with good spectator facilities and minimised costs for competitors. I doubt that's a popular view, though.

[Al Weyman]

CSCC Tintops would be fine for me, but doesn't allow carbs where injection was standard, does it? Same applies to pre-93s - is that a recent rule-change, as i'm sure original regs allowed that swap.

That came in last year in Pre-93's and nearly outlawed my car as there was no why I was going to go over to fuel injection and eCU's as it would cost thousands even though it would probably have meant more power/torque as I understand the big old Holley, fortunately as the car originally had that carb fitted we found a work around. I see both sides of the argument for the carbs and would say overall if it was down to me I would allow them in lieu of injection especially when one is up against the M3 which came with throttle bodies from the factory as I understand it but there you go you pick what suits you.

[jlr]

I've just been reading this and it all sounds very interesting. Appears they've put up an update on their website....

http://www.clubmsv.com/club-msv-racing.aspx

[Mach3]

Thanks for the feedback guys, have looked at a couple of options now as am keen to get the E30 out for real rather than just track days!

Originally Posted by Tim Wilkinson

Personally I doubt the concept will have much effect, any take-up is likely to come because it's MSV and they're a known name in trackday-land, where a lot (all?) of the motorsport clubs aren't.

In my view what stops trackdayers having an occasional race is the cost of making that step to racing. It's two-fold - the cost of prepping a safe track / road car to "race" standards e.g. extinguisher, cut-offs, dated harnesses, helmet and race-suit, timing equipment; and the personal costs - medical costs, about £300 to do the ARDs, £50 a year for a license. And it goes on....

I agree, I was surprised to find just how much it would cost to actually be ready for racing, let alone then doing it.

Originally Posted by jlr

I've just been reading this and it all sounds very interesting. Appears they've put up an update on their website....

http://www.clubmsv.com/club-msv-racing.aspx

Think this looks my best bet tbh. The CSCC series look good too, but after the above expenses, and considering I might not be able to afford a whole season, think the MSV format might work better. Hopefully I'll be on the grid next season - thanks again for the advice!

[Al Weyman]

They mention Camaro in the elligible cars then say it has to be restricted to 200bhp per ton. Any self respecting Camaro would have way in excess of that and my IROC-Z left the factory with more than that and thats before you start tuning the engine and stripping away the excess weight, my car now weighs with steel panels and glass around 1300kgs (until I get in the thing :-)). I don't think power to weight is any good at all restricting or levelling performance as it all that takes into account is acceleration not braking and cornering where the lighter cars will be quids in.

[andypipe]

ven my escort wouldnt be allowed at 230 bhp/ton