2011 British F3 off Season/Silly season news etc (merge)

[NaBUru38]

F3 Euroseries teams Mücke, ART and Prema accepted the invitiation to the 2010 British F3 rounds at Silverstone and Spa (which were supporting the FIA GT1). If the F3 Euroseries disappears, I wonder whether those teams (and Signature and Motopark) will switch to British F3, or instead strenghten their entries in other formula series. Also, do you believe that the British F3 will add more FIA GT1 supporting races? Media coverage is much bigger there than in ADAC or Superleague weekends.

[NaBUru38]

Am I a telepath or what? Check these two Motors TV news:

"Brands Hatch, Oulton Park and Snetterton are all set to be snubbed for next year’s British F3 International Series.

A provisional list of races has been put forward to Stephane Ratel and includes five overseas races and another five in the UK. However none of the UK rounds are set to be at MotorSport Vision tracks.

The five races set to be held outside of Britain could include the Nurburgring in Germany, Monza in Italy, Paul Ricard in France, Portimao in Portugal and Spa-Francorchamps in Belgium." (All these races are part of the FIA GT1!)

"A number of the leading Formula 3 Euro Series teams are set to join the British Series for next season."

[NaBUru38]

Oops, Monza doesn't. Perhaps it will in 2011.

Another quote from here: "Team bosses are believed to have requested the move away from MSV circuits in favour of overseas tracks that regularly feature rounds of major championships such as Formula One, GP2, GP3, GT1 and World Touring Car." Of course, drivers who want to climb higher prefer to race where the higher rank do.

[Flavio Galtieri]

Originally Posted by NaBUru38

Am I a telepath or what? Check these two Motors TV news:

"Brands Hatch, Oulton Park and Snetterton are all set to be snubbed for next year’s British F3 International Series.

I really don't get this at all. I understand the desire to maximise the discomfort of the failing Euroseries from a business point of view but I can't understand why removing three classic British circuits from the calendar is considered a good idea?

British F3 should be just that in my opinion. I can't see any problems with facilities for a F3 team. As for safety considerations top speeds through the trap aren't that much higher than FF Duratec.

All it will do is make bloated budgets even higher. A complete nonsence.

[jondownunder]

So British F3 could almost become the new F3 Euro Series - and we just about lose our top national series. It sounds like what happened in France and Germany all over again. If the F3ES teams found their series too expensive to maintain a presence when GP3 came along, then surely British F3 expanding into Europe will face similar problems?

It's sad that with GP3's British visit being inaccessible for fans, potentially no more F3ES at Brands and F2 being a complete irrelevance, the choice of sub GP2/WSbR single seater meetings to visit (and have paddock access) will drop dramatically.

I usually make it to Oulton (and the much closer Thruxton this year). At least Thruxton could stay which like Oulton is always worth visiting from a photography/paddock access/good racing standpoint. Silverstone, Donington and Rockingham don't offer a good spectator experience as far as I'm concerned, so I never attend those rounds.

[courageous]

I get the feeling this is more anti-MSV than pro-Euro.
don't know the real reasons (other than money/power) but the british racing big wigs fall out like this every few years.

[Richard B]

RIP "British f3" ?

[jondownunder]

Originally Posted by courageous

I get the feeling this is more anti-MSV than pro-Euro.
don't know the real reasons (other than money/power) but the british racing big wigs fall out like this every few years.

I wonder if Palmer/MSV plan on scaling F2 back to a national "Super FPA" in the future, if rumours of FIA withdrawing support after 2011 are true? Total speculation on my part, but maybe that could have something to do with it? There's obviously something more going on as you say.

[strider]

We've had all this 'goodbye British F3' stuff before, when the British F3 Championship became the British F3 International Series.

Despite the stories of doom and gloom, however, the fact is that the Series is currently the strongest out there and the reason is that SRO has listened to the teams and the teams have respected the wishes of the people who pay their budgets, the drivers.

So far as the MSV circuits are concerned, BF3 has managed without them before and will do so again if that's what it comes to. A couple of facts: as you would expect of a shrewd businessman, Mr Palmer charges more for BF3 to race on his circuits than any other circuit owner and you can't cherry pick. You have to take all three - Oulton Park, Snetterton and Brands Hatch GP.

As drivers' circuits, Oulton and Brands are great, but that's where it stops. There's hardly any overtaking and there's no such thing as a cheap accident there. These things count. It's also a fact that having the Easter Monday slot at Oulton is not great. A couple of years ago it was the coldest meeting I can remember.

[duke_toaster]

If they want to avoid MSV tracks, surely they could go to places like Mondello Park (when was the last time they had a big car meeting there?), Anglesey, another round at Silverstone, Knockhill etc ...

[bella]

british f3 at mondello was ridiculous. the track was too small and they barely had to change gear. i suspect that also applies for any of the more club and bike orientated circuits. nice thought, ain't gonna happen.

[NaBUru38]

Silverstone, Donington, Thruxton, Rockingham, Croft, Knockhill. That's six. Visiting two of them twice and visiting two foreign circuits gives ten as now.

[NaBUru38]

The New Hampshire race was moved to August 14, since the Nascar will race in mid July and late September. So where does Sears Point fit? Nobody would put that race one week after racing in the opposite corner of the country.

[MikeHoyer]

Is it just me that likes the idea of more races abroad?

[strider]

Originally Posted by NaBUru38

Silverstone, Donington, Thruxton, Rockingham, Croft, Knockhill. That's six. Visiting two of them twice and visiting two foreign circuits gives ten as now.

There will probably be two races at Silverstone, as there have been this year. Forget Knockhill and, sadly, Croft, so that leaves five races abroad, which is what I am expecting to see.

Originally Posted by MikeHoyer

Is it just me that likes the idea of more races abroad?

No, I think the races abroad add a lot to the Series, especially when they're at decent circuits, so bring back Monza and Portimao!

[Richard B]

From a purely selfish point of view I enjoy 1 or 2 overseas races (Portimao especially) but trying to go to every British F3 race in a year on a budget is not easy if half of them are abroad. Not just financially but in terms of time away from the other job etc.

[strider]

I totally understand and sympathise with that point of view, Richard B. It has something to do with why I am not even at Silverstone this weekend.

However, I suspect that you are in the minority in trying to get to as many meetings as possible. If there are 5 in this country, that may be as many as most people can manage.

[EastonNeston]

I agree with Richard B, trying to get to 5 overseas races is difficult, and expensive, not just financially, but in time.

It is important to go to have a few good quality overseas meetings, something that we had before SRO. However the meetings should be at top quality circuits. Like many people, I think the 2005 season where F3 raced alongside the LMS series was the best for non UK races with trips to Spa, Monza and the Nurburgring.

[strider]

Originally Posted by EastonNeston

It is important to go to have a few good quality overseas meetings, something that we had before SRO. However the meetings should be at top quality circuits. Like many people, I think the 2005 season where F3 raced alongside the LMS series was the best for non UK races with trips to Spa, Monza and the Nurburgring.

2005 was a great season and I went to all those circuits - Monza remains the best F3 race meeting ever - but SRO took over in 2004. Stephane Ratel is, or was then, also involved in the LMS series.

[NaBUru38]

So the best looking candidates for these international British F3 races are FIA GT1 meetings. WTCC / FIA F2 weekends are second.

[strider]

Originally Posted by NaBUru38

So the best looking candidates for these international British F3 races are FIA GT1 meetings. WTCC / FIA F2 weekends are second.

Sorry, forget the second option. No love lost there. LMS meetings are still a possibility; it's just that FIA GT1 meetings make better economic sense to SRO.

[duke_toaster]

However, would The Honey Badger put one of his series appear on the undercard of LMS, bearing in mind that he runs FIA GT1 and the LMS people have got rid of his cars from their races?

[EastonNeston]

LMS meetings would be better, F3 and the teams have more in common with the LMS series than with a GT series. When F3 raced with LMS in 2005 the F3 races were given really good time slots and good paddock locations.

[gt_torque]

I'm surprised how many of you guys on here are giving SRO a bashing when they are clearly listening to the teams and trying to balance this with the financial implications of having an, in effect, 'euro series'.

That report on Motors TV was unofficial, and will be by no means the final calendar for the year ahead. Discussions are ongoing with all circuits, including MSV and the calendar isn't yet finalised - they've said that themselves.

As someone pointed out earlier, Mr Palmer is very shrewd and offers an 'all or nothing' approach to his circuits. Its a hard balance to strike for the organisers as a number of the British GT teams like going to Snet, Oulton and Brands, especially Snet as it will soon get a significant upgrade from council /external funding.

Unfortunately, Snet doesn't really offer much for F3 cars (on the form of the last few years), so if the F3 teams don't want to go there, that's sort of understandable - but because of the way the circuits are sold, you can't pick and mix your packages and circuits (damn!!). So, this little conundrum means that without GT and F3 (and VW, FormulaFord etc) working together, the series would possibly flounder. If they all work together, there could be a lot to be gained for the teams of all championships concerned.

Re: Racing at Oulton Park, on Easter weekend this can cost teams a fortune because its such a drawn out race meeting and they need to cater/provide rooms for all their staff (See Trevor Carlin's comment in Autosport last week). For the same price they could go to Hockenheim. Bit of a no-brainer, no? Investigate testing costs from MSV too. I think some of you might be pointing the finger at the wrong person here.

Alan Gow has shown the importance of building strong packages (TOCA) and his approach while not textbook, does shed light on how to gain public interest and build championships. Oh and for the record, I can't see F3 being a regular bedfellow of LMS, although the odd round might be do-able.

Going back to the original point, and to clarify, F3 teams really only want to race on 'prestige' international circuits such as those raced on by F1 etc. This is understandable for marketing and sponsorship reasons. However, these circuits are wise to this and thus charge accordingly.

Going back to circuits such as Mondello, Pembrey, Anglesey are all options, but the consensus in the paddock is that F3 has outgrown some of these tracks and it needs to aim higher. Knockhill probably won't be on the calendar because its too far away, and the circuit by its nature is a bit of a car wrecker - but I could be wrong.

If you read between the lines, SRO is trying to evolve F3 into something that rightly reflects its position as the top national single seater championship in the UK, and a key stepping stone in any future F1 drivers career. Just give them some time to finalise plans... This weekend's races were superb and JEV is a worthy champion for the series.

[strider]

Originally Posted by gt_torque

I'm surprised how many of you guys on here are giving SRO a bashing when they are clearly listening to the teams and trying to balance this with the financial implications of having an, in effect, 'euro series'.

Agreed.

Originally Posted by gt_torque

Going back to circuits such as Mondello, Pembrey, Anglesey are all options, but the consensus in the paddock is that F3 has outgrown some of these tracks and it needs to aim higher. Knockhill probably won't be on the calendar because its too far away, and the circuit by its nature is a bit of a car wrecker - but I could be wrong.

I agree with what bella said about Mondello. Pembrey does better financially out of F3 testing than it would from a single meeting there. I don't think Anglesey cuts the mustard, frankly.

Originally Posted by gt_torque

If you read between the lines, SRO is trying to evolve F3 into something that rightly reflects its position as the top national single seater championship in the UK, and a key stepping stone in any future F1 drivers career. Just give them some time to finalise plans...

As long as SRO really does listen to the teams it should work out, but they need to come out with a calendar a bit earlier than sometime in January.