Are my race overalls still legal?

[Al Weyman]

I have a pair of AWS Triple Nomex overalls about 8 or 9 years old, they are mint and I have only worn them a dozen times or so and would obviously like to keep using them.

They are marked 01.133.FIA RAC.90. I can't seem to see this reference in the Blue Book.

[Eddy V]

Al,
I think the suit is too old. I'm not familiar with the blue book rules, but in my AWS catalogue it states EN533 for the latest UK suits.
An FIA spec suit is labelled FIA 8856-2000.
Give Nick a call 01233-638498

[Chris Y]

The blue book is a little vague on this, possibly with good reason. It says "Flame resistant overalls may be manufactured from Nomex III, Proban, or equivalent materials".

It then goes on to say: "Acceptable standards:
B.S.6249 part 1 index A or B (but not C)*
BSEN522*
Pr EN533:1995. Index 3*
FIA standard overalls"

Those marked with a (*) expire at the end of this year. I think that's mainly the Proban and B.S. approved stuff.

Al, your overalls should fit into the last category - FIA standard, as they ave been FIA approved. Only if you're doing international events do you need FIA 1986 (not after this year) or FIA 8856-2000.

[Al Weyman]

Thanks guys, it is very confusing as seen by the two conflicting answers. I only plan to do UK club events.

[Chris Y]

If I was a betting man, I would put money on your overalls still being legal. They're 'FIA standard', and by the letter of the Blue Book, they're legal.

Still kinda waiting for someone like midgetman to visit the thread and impart some expert advice though

[haggispeed]

As Chris correctly says if your playsuit has "FIA" embroidered on them then they are legal for UK events regardless of the FIA standard they meet. For International grade events you will need FIA 8856-2000.

[Truckosaurus]

It might be worth contacting the manufacturer as sometimes they can re-approve an old suit with a new label if it still meets new standards which were brought in after the suit was made.

[Ali Rushforth]

My suit has a FIA label on it, not sure of the whole number but it ends with 1986. I was reminded by a scrut earlier this month that I need a new suit before Jan 1st 2006 as that standard runs out this year. So I'm guessing that as yours ends with 1990, you're ok for a few more years.

Changing subject slightly, helmets standards also run out this year, mine being one of them!! (Bloody expensive Christmas this year for me!!!)

[Tim Falce]

It depends where the 1986 and 1990 is written, mine has Norme 1986 standard along the top and has 05.201CSAI.94 underneath but I think mine will be out of date at the end of this year.

[Al Weyman]

well I have had to bite the bullet and buy a new helmet as well as my old one I don't think woukd have cut it although I have probably only worn it 20 times or so. I wonder how long this new one will last before I have to buy a new one, and they wonder why people are dropping out of the sport.

[midgetman]

I'm here, I'm here! Sorry, been working for a change....

FIA 01.133.FIA RAC.90 is under the old Norme 86 standard which is OK for UK natioanl level for the foreseeable. There should be no problem with the fabric as it does not degrade. The "RAC 90" bit means it was homologated in 1990 in GB not that it was made then. I bet if you look above those numbers it says "Norme 86"

Just jealous you can still get into an 8-year-old overall Al; in my case, the question is totally academic becaue they wouldn't fit me anyway. Too big for me now - in my dreams ;-) Hate these people who can use old suits, seriously affects my racing budget.

Guy - FYI you can't retro-approve a suit to different standards. A few years ago Jays added a badge saying "this suit complies with....." on their products, but that's gone by the wayside now.

Ali - your helmet - is that Snell 95? Had to buy a new one myself this year. It hurts the wallet.

HTH

Max

[Al Weyman]

Thanx midgetman that is good to know, the reason I can still get into it is because I was a fat git then when I bought them and nothing has changed, they are a size 56 chest!!!!

[graeme]

Originally Posted by Ali Rushforth

My suit has a FIA label on it, not sure of the whole number but it ends with 1986. I was reminded by a scrut earlier this month that I need a new suit before Jan 1st 2006 as that standard runs out this year.

I'm not aware that FIA 1986 suits are being delisted for next year. (Been through the whole standards rigmarole for racing at Spa next month, so am fairly familiar with it). I hate to suggest it but perhaps the scrut was mistaken!?

[StephenRae]

This year various scrutineers have warned me that my helmet (blue sticker) my overalls (1986 I think) and my seat belts (dated 1995 2" wide) are all due for replacement. I hope thy are wrong or I am in for a very expensive winter!

[haggispeed]

Originally Posted by StephenRae

This year various scrutineers have warned me that my helmet (blue sticker) my overalls (1986 I think) and my seat belts (dated 1995 2" wide) are all due for replacement. I hope thy are wrong or I am in for a very expensive winter!

Helmet will only be out if it is Snell 95, if it is Snell 2000 but the sticker is out of date they will just re-inspect it for you and re-sticker for a fee of £1. Overalls if they have FIA embroidered in DO NOT go out of homologation next year for UK Club Events, only international as from 1-1-2005. All seat belts from 1-1-2006 must comply with FIA regs and have a manufacturing date label sewn into them, currently FIA regs state 3" shoulder and 2" waist straps.
That means there is likely to be a shortage of harnesses available about a week before the season starts next year as everyone trys to get belts with a 2006 date on them

[graeme]

Silly thing with race suits is I've got a snazy 3-layer Sparco Top5 (?), but it's FIA1986 on the collar (I'm sure it would meet FIA2000 spec, it's just not labelled as such). For Spa, I've bought a new race suit which is only 2-layer but has FIA2000 certification. I guess it might offer less protection than my old suit...!? I'll continue to use my old suit at UK races.

[Ali Rushforth]

Midgetman, yes my helmet is Snell 95, have looked in Demon Theives and they don't do the same helmet anymore either so I have to spends loads of money on a totally new type!!!

Graeme, hope you're right!!

[Sheila M]

Can I suggest that you guys contact a scrutineer for clarification? You should find a local one named in your Blue Book.

No point in you spending money if there's no need, or turning up at a race meeting with kit that is not acceptable.

Sheila

[Tim Falce]

Sheila, the trouble with asking a scroot is that you can get half a dozen different interpretations of a rule from two different scrutineers.

[Sheila M]

Originally Posted by falcemob

Sheila, the trouble with asking a scroot is that you can get half a dozen different interpretations of a rule from two different scrutineers.

Then ask someone on the technical commission!

[midgetman]

I have been assured verbally that Norme 86 standards are acceptable for the foreseeable future (by the MSA technical department) and that any change owould be give a transition period - as happened when Proban became illegal.

Just to re-iterate there is no way the scrutineer can tell the age of overalls from the label on the neck, any that reckons they can is, dare I say it, in error. Not that scrutineers ever make errors of course.

[R59]

The FIA harness bit also has the proviso that when used with a HANS device, they may be 2" shoulder (homologated for HANS use).

Rob.

[graeme]

Originally Posted by midgetman

there is no way the scrutineer can tell the age of overalls from the label on the neck

Apart from reading the stitching that says "Year of manufacture:" (I think it's a new thing - it wasn't on my three year old overalls)

[Eddy V]

Yep, the year thing is new. The manufacturers have to do it to avoid cheating afterwards.

[midgetman]

>>>>>>>"Year of manufacture:"

Yup, on 8856-2000 not the Norme 86 we were talking about ;-) 'pologies, should have made that clearer.

Not sure whether there's an expiry date for 8856-2000. Will research and report back.