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18 Oct 2002, 09:53 (Ref:407083)
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Racer
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 208
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Oh no. Another Tilke-Ring....
From Autosport.com
"Formula 1 is heading to the most populous nation on earth, China, after FIA president Max Mosley confirmed that the new Shanghai facility will host the Chinese Grand Prix from 2004 to 2010. Speaking at the official opening ceremony of the ‘Shang' circuit, Mosley praised the efforts of the Chinese authorities and their commitment to producing a world class racing facility, which will attract substantial foreign interest and investment. "Formula 1 is the biggest annual global sporting event - and it has been my ambition since becoming FIA President, that Formula 1 should have a home in the world's largest nation - that ambition will be realised in 2004 when the world of Formula One will arrive in Shanghai," he said. "Let me thank everyone involved in this project, including the Motorsport Federation of China and say how much I look forward to returning in 2004 for the first Formula 1 Grand Prix of China in Shanghai." The 5.44km track has been designed by Hermann Tilke, and will resemble the Chinese character ‘shang'. It will cost an estimated $244 million, accommodate 200,000 spectators and should be completed in March 2004." Good news about F1 heading to China. Bad news Hermann Tilke designing another BS racetrack. Thats my call. |
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Adelaide is the world's best street circut. 
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18 Oct 2002, 10:30 (Ref:407098)
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#2 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 3,665
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What does a "shang" look like then, and which other tracks has this Tilke bloke designed (Please don't tell me Hockenheim!)
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__________________
It's just my opinion.
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18 Oct 2002, 10:40 (Ref:407103)
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#3 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 5,917
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It looks something like an inverted "T" but with a horizontal short line on the right of the inverted T, in the middle of the vertical part.
If i'm not wrong, Tilke has designed the Sepang race track, the new Austria race track, the new "mickey mouse" part of the modern Nurburgring, the new Hockenheim... Last edited by Gt_R; 18 Oct 2002 at 10:43. |
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__________________
Alonso: "McLaren and Williams are also great racing teams, but Ferrari is the biggest one that you can go to."
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18 Oct 2002, 10:44 (Ref:407107)
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#4 | |
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Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 1,473
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Yeah Tilkie was responsible for the design of the new Hockenheim ring.
5.44km is (by my reckoning) about 3.4 miles, which is pretty long by todays standards. |
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18 Oct 2002, 11:18 (Ref:407129)
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#5 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 4,936
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 "Tight corners are slow corners, and that takes the edge off the risk." -Hermann Tilke I wish he would die. I really, really do... He's also been hired to destroy Silverstone. This is what his criminal mind came up with:  He's also been asked to design a new track in Poland. Which is at least more palatable than China. Now I've got no problem with the Chinese people, but their leadership actually makes ours look respectable! Nothing but a huge pack of filthy plutocrats who murder their own people whenever they demand basic human rights, and currently occupy several rightly sovereign nations, particularly Tibet. I'm sure Bernie's perfectly comfortable doing business with people representing such a level of pure evil, but the rest of the F1 circus should have some second thoughts. China may want the Ferrari technical team to stay a bit long for some "consultation". There's a reason they call it being "shanghied". Last edited by Lee Janotta; 18 Oct 2002 at 11:27. |
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__________________
"Put a ****ing wheel on there! Let me go out again!" -Gilles Villeneuve, Zandvoort, 1979
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18 Oct 2002, 12:52 (Ref:407188)
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#6 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 7,294
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How on earth did Tilke get a reputation as a good track designer? Every single piece he has designed has been boring, bland and does not produce good racing (ok, Austria has produced a bit here and there but nothing worth shouting about.)
How about giving that guy who designed Suzuka and Zandvoort a run, unless he's dead, then that rules him out... But surely, SURELY, there is someone who can design a better track!!!! How about mac? Have you seen some of his great designs in the Gravel Trap?  
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Sunderland Til I Die!
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18 Oct 2002, 13:12 (Ref:407195)
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#7 | ||
 Race Official20KPINAL
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 21,606
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Uhn... Come on Lee. No politics please. Let's stick to the subject: Bash Mr. Hermann Tilke
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__________________
Show me a man who won't give it to his woman An' I'll show you somebody who will
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18 Oct 2002, 13:21 (Ref:407200)
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#8 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2000
Posts: 5,867
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"I wish he would die. I really, really do..." Jeez....
 It's a sport fer chrissake! It's fun you know! Try to see it as fun not as a life and death matter every once in a while.
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18 Oct 2002, 13:48 (Ref:407211)
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#9 | ||
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Racer
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 221
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Maybe the FIA should add a 10th point to their plan
10) Provide the drivers with challenging tracks to drive on, rather than the current sanitised, uber-safe Mickey-Mouse circuits. |
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18 Oct 2002, 13:50 (Ref:407212)
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#10 | |
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Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 7,979
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Well,... I would suggest Mr Tilke to consider a career in designing toilets or garden furniture and leave the F1 tracks to capable designers...
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18 Oct 2002, 13:59 (Ref:407219)
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#11 | ||
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Racer
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 188
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How it comes "no politics"? F1 is all about politics...and auw...no problem with good ol' racing in apartheid South Africa. Action was wild too in Videla's Argentina.
At least racetracks were fast and Tilke was not around. |
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18 Oct 2002, 14:11 (Ref:407227)
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#12 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 3,665
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Presumably overtaking is supposed to take place at the hairpin, which is at the end of that long straight.
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__________________
It's just my opinion.
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18 Oct 2002, 14:11 (Ref:407228)
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#13 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,245
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Hey, this "Shanghai" has a great straight at the bottom, and a nice main straight at the start
Looks like a power-track to me..., maybe this is a draft to get the contract, and then he takes out the scissors... |
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__________________
"ignorantia legis neminem excusat"
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18 Oct 2002, 14:12 (Ref:407229)
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#14 | |
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Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 7,979
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And Suzuka was designed in 1963 by some guy named John Hugenholt(z) (something that sounded like that) and designed Zandvoort also, not really sure if he's still alive but im rather pessimistic about that since he wasn't particularly "young" at the time...
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18 Oct 2002, 14:12 (Ref:407230)
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#15 | |
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Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 7,979
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At least i don't think he was young..
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18 Oct 2002, 14:30 (Ref:407239)
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#16 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 5,917
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Quote:"I wish he would die. I really, really do..."
"people (the Chinese leadership or people?) representing such a level of pure evil" Kind of uncalled for isn't it? Whoever this hyped up designer is...he's just doing a professional job. Wishing death upon somebody isn't really in the American's blood is it? Afterall...weren't they crying out for all the human rights violation... And though i'm NOT a China-Chinese, and personally dont really rate them high (despite me being a chinese too, but a Singaporean-chinese), not let your biased nature against them get the better of you. They do have a couple of very capable leaders and murder isn't really their main agenda. Leave such level of inter-country politics stay out, if you don't mind. But back to the topic, i must admit slow hairpins are really eyesores to me. But ironically, they are usually the ones to provide overtaking nowadays. Tilkes designs may look boring, but at least they produce a fair bit of kick every now and then. |
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Alonso: "McLaren and Williams are also great racing teams, but Ferrari is the biggest one that you can go to."
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18 Oct 2002, 14:39 (Ref:407243)
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#17 | ||
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Ten-Tenths Hall of Fame
Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 3,840
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The first turn is exactly the same as Sepang!
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18 Oct 2002, 15:04 (Ref:407253)
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#18 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2000
Posts: 4,413
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THIS is what a F1 track should look like:
 and yes, unfortunately Hans Hugenholz sr. is dead. a lap around the Zandvoort track onboard with Michael Bleekemolen in a Fitipaldi(he ownes it): http://www.circuit-zandvoort.nl/circuit/track/index.asp Last edited by steve nielsen; 18 Oct 2002 at 15:09. |
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18 Oct 2002, 15:10 (Ref:407255)
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#19 | ||
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Ten-Tenths Hall of Fame
Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 3,840
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Steve...sorry you have it wrong there. The first half is OK. But a true F1 track should look like Zandvoort used to be before it was changed to your example. The main straight was twice as long!
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18 Oct 2002, 15:16 (Ref:407258)
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#20 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 4,936
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Well, I've been asked by the moderator not to bring global politics into the discussion anymore, so I'll respect that call. I've made my point clear about why Formula 1 shouldn't race in China.
GT_R... One word. "Tiananmen." I'll leave it at that. Ah... Zandvoort... How I miss that old track. Damn housing developers made sure that'd never be much of a venue again.  Here's what it looked like when F1 ran on it.   As for Tilke... Hey, I didn't say anyone should kill him, just life'd be a lot nicer if he wasn't breathing anymore. You'll agree with me when they let him loose on Suzuka in a couple years time. |
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__________________
"Put a ****ing wheel on there! Let me go out again!" -Gilles Villeneuve, Zandvoort, 1979
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18 Oct 2002, 15:17 (Ref:407259)
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#21 | |
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Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 7,979
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Zandvoort is an excellent track, only a bit tight at times...
They should widen the track a bit, especially on the star/finish straight... Last edited by ASCII Man; 18 Oct 2002 at 15:19. |
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18 Oct 2002, 16:19 (Ref:407298)
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#22 | |
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Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2000
Posts: 4,477
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Lee, wishing death on someone is not something we like to see in this forum. Please refrain from it in the future, and find other ways of airing your disagreement over the horrible tracks designed by mr. Tilke.
I wish that he would do something else in stead of designing F1 tracks.
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__________________
"An ignorant person is one who doesn't know what you've just found out" - Will Rogers
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18 Oct 2002, 16:31 (Ref:407317)
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#23 | |
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Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 7,979
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Like i did?
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18 Oct 2002, 17:06 (Ref:407328)
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#24 | |||
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Race Official 20KPINAL
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 21,606
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Quote:
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__________________
Show me a man who won't give it to his woman An' I'll show you somebody who will
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18 Oct 2002, 17:44 (Ref:407348)
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#25 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 5,276
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Can't he do a radical track for once? I wish he designed two straights with two hairpins.. there'd be more passing!
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__________________
"Many people depend on motor racing for their livelihood, to them it is a business. To me, it is a sport." -Jim Clark
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