Touring cars or production cars, who makes better racing?

[Razor]

What would you choose? After a disscussion with a mate of mine yesterday, he said that while the V8's a good to watch, the golden olden days of racing with production cars were better entertainment. So this got me thinking, what would the general race fans like more, todays V8 Supercars or if CAMS brang back the production car type of racing back in the mainstream?

In my opinion, bring back the production racing that was done in the 70's. Keep it stock except for saftey gear and if you have some form of small advantage, keep it instead of going through a year of political bs to see if it good for the sport of not.

[Pro Racer]

i love the old Group C & A classes but i think that todays racing is good but the old days take the cake.

[racer69]

by touring cars i hope you don't mean V8Supercars.....

Production Cars refer to the likes of Series Production, Group E, the early 90s Bathurst 12hrs etc....

Touring Cars refer to the likes of Group C, Group A, whilst in looser terms the early V8Supercars, Super Touring etc etc....

[Falcadore]

Originally Posted by Razor

What would you choose? After a disscussion with a mate of mine yesterday, he said that while the V8's a good to watch, the golden olden days of racing with production cars were better entertainment. So this got me thinking, what would the general race fans like more, todays V8 Supercars or if CAMS brang back the production car type of racing back in the mainstream?

In my opinion, bring back the production racing that was done in the 70's. Keep it stock except for saftey gear and if you have some form of small advantage, keep it instead of going through a year of political bs to see if it good for the sport of not.

Seriously V8 Supercars have moved beyond Touring cars and are a bit like NASCAR, DTM, or the aborted PROCAR regs of 1988 and is a silouhette series.

Touring Cars is really classes like WTCC and BTCC.

[Casper]

You know how everyone complains that SC racing is boring, that is basically because all the cars are the same spec. Production cars will fix that problem because the cars are all different, even those of the same make can be different enough to be seen. It also sorts out the drivers, those who can manage a race car that isn't quite as good as it could be and gives brakes and tyres a hard time and those who just drive it as hard as it will go.

[Razor]

When I mean touring cars, I do mean the current V8 Supercars.

[DAVID PATERSON]

Originally Posted by Razor

When I mean touring cars, I do mean the current V8 Supercars.

Maybe you ought to change the options and title to avoid confusing people. I like touring car racing best, but it's not an option in your pole.

[Green Hornet]

Originally Posted by racer69

by touring cars i hope you don't mean V8Supercars.....

Production Cars refer to the likes of Series Production, Group E, the early 90s Bathurst 12hrs etc....

Touring Cars refer to the likes of Group C, Group A, whilst in looser terms the early V8Supercars, Super Touring etc etc....

Are you suggesting the latter are touring cars and that V8 Supercars are not?

[Steve Carter]

You know how everyone complains that SC racing is boring

Thats very correct Safety Car racing isnt that exciting Casper

I dont know I think you would have to go to the WTCC formula if you want something in the middle of what was Group C & Group A - both were formulas for their time and both exciting for what they were. I do miss the various classes that were employed in the Australian Touring Car championships and the full fields at Bathurst - 52 cars wasnt it. I think with V8 Supercars now the parity rules are so tight that racing is becoming - well - boring. If you did have a formula where you had another 2-3 makes in the Supercars or if the Ford & Holden teams were homologated into a WTCC series you would still have that tribal rivalry between the two camps and the racing could be fantastic - just my two cents

[Oldtony]

Series production with saety mods and some relaxation on electronics chips, exhaust downstream of manifold, fuel cells etc. Upper price limits and price structure together with capacity to set classes. The B12 has something like the right idea but the detail needs improving.
Racing has to be in an enduro format, About 4hrs min.

[racer69]

Originally Posted by Green Hornet

Are you suggesting the latter are touring cars and that V8 Supercars are not?

I wasn't suggesting it, i was saying it

[Green Hornet]

Originally Posted by racer69

I wasn't suggesting it, i was saying it

Mmmmm . . . so how did you work that one out?

Maybe you can enlighten on what is or not a touring car and why a V8 Supercar isn't one?

[speedraced04]

production cars are awesome, but only with grids of 30-35+, and a good range of cars in each class

12-15 cars, with 6-7 in one class and 1-2 in the others isnt a true reflection of how good production car racing is

[Oldtony]

Ever tried to tour from Sydney to the Gold Coast in a V8SC.
Once upon a time when the good fairy lived at the bottom of the garden it was not uncommon for touring cars or sports cars to be driven too and from the circuit. David McKay used to drive the LM250 Ferrari to all events, including interstate.
I can recall the Leaton Motors D Type being used to collect parts from 60miles away when the "transporter" broke down.
But seriously, maybe it should be a requirement of entry that a touring car should be road registered.

[Wood-duck]

The V8 Supercar champion is presented with the trophy for winning the Australian Touring Car Championship.

I dont agree with this anymore, but that is what happens. I agree with Falc, they are more like NASCAR's and DTM cars these days.

What about what the Kiwi's are up to with there NZV8's...? They look great and produce good racing. What are they worth to build ?

[David Towe]

Muscle Car Masters in September at the creek will showcase some great "Touring Cars" and provide good battles throughout the entire field of 30+ genuine "historic touring cars', see you there?

[Senna05]

Well, by the definitions given in here, this means V8SC is a silhouette category, and that what we call Production Cars are Touring Cars? (Particularly in the forms of the GTS and GT-P?)

[Casper]

Series Prod was the go until we started to get some really interesting Sports Sedans. The first had more go than stop, an essential ingredient in any racing that wants to be entertaining and the latter were so innovative and all so different that it resulted in huge interest. McCormacks charger, the demented Corvair of Gardner etc. Now bring back that sort of innovation and I don't care whether it is SS or SP.