Daytime driving lights

[justracing]

I readily admit that it's hardly historic related but it'a subject worth raising amongst members of the older generation, specifically what idiot came up with the idea of daytime driving lights which only operate the front side lights? It's beginning to drive me insane when approaching vehicles with absolutely no rear lights driving in gloomy/darkening conditions and then glancing behind having overtaken to observe two meagre illuminated front side lights. It would appear from observation that the drivers of said vehicles seem totally oblivious to the fact that they cannot be seen from behind and present a real danger on the road. The old adage that I was taught was to see and more importantly be seen. Maybe it's just me being a grumpy old fart.

[ChrisA]

Not all cars are '' dark'' at the rear with day time running lights. I have a c class Merc and my rear lights are on, automatically. No, you're not grumpy.

[GORDON STREETER]

Originally Posted by justracing

I readily admit that it's hardly historic related but it'a subject worth raising amongst members of the older generation, specifically what idiot came up with the idea of daytime driving lights which only operate the front side lights? It's beginning to drive me insane when approaching vehicles with absolutely no rear lights driving in gloomy/darkening conditions and then glancing behind having overtaken to observe two meagre illuminated front side lights. It would appear from observation that the drivers of said vehicles seem totally oblivious to the fact that they cannot be seen from behind and present a real danger on the road. The old adage that I was taught was to see and more importantly be seen. Maybe it's just me being a grumpy old fart.

Let's face it the people that bring in a lot of these new rules have probably never driven thousands of miles for over 50 years and just sit on a computer to decide. While I am on here I hope that I am not the only person to be blinded by modern car lights at night ? I know that some people don't know how to dip their lights (or the auto dip is set wrong) and even if they do dip them they are still too bright or high or both. Yes I am a grumpy old fart !

[Tel 911S]

Originally Posted by GORDON STREETER

Let's face it the people that bring in a lot of these new rules have probably never driven thousands of miles for over 50 years and just sit on a computer to decide. While I am on here I hope that I am not the only person to be blinded by modern car lights at night ? I know that some people don't know how to dip their lights (or the auto dip is set wrong) and even if they do dip them they are still too bright or high or both. Yes I am a grumpy old fart !

Agree , a lot of the people who make the rules are clueless .
But it does get confusing .
A couple of years ago we had a motor go in for IVA testing . The bloke who took it in phoned from the ministry station saying the rules had been changed and now rear fog lights must be separately switched on each time and not come on again when the normal lights are switched on .I quickly made up a switching arrangement with a momentary switch and relay , took it to the test station , fitted it and the yester was happy and the motor passed .

We all know that people who leave their fog lights on are idiots , and that is a good idea that they do not stay on. But doing some checking afterwards we found out that the ministry station had got it all wrong and that was not the new rules .
So what chance do most people have in knowing what is what .

[justracing]

My initial comments were rather based more on the driver of the vehicle in question, it would appear that most offenders jump in the vehicle and flick the light switch to the first setting thinking that this actually energises both front and rear lights totally unaware that they cannot be seen from the rear because they have not taken the trouble to examine the settings. You see it all the time with the driver confident that they have their lights on when in fact only the front side lights are lit. Whoever came up with this idea in the first place is idiotic.

[JasperClan]

Apart from daytime lights only being illuminated at the front, fogs lights being left on and badly adjusted headlights am I alone in noting the certain manufacturers are adopting smaller indicators and including them withing the complete light units. The worst I find to be Vauxhall and Volkswagen.

[Lancsbreaker]

Pretty much all of the above.......I think things could be improved if dashboard lights weren't illuminated unless at a minimum side and rear lights were on. As a first time user of a car with DRLs I've been caught out a couple of times setting off knowing there was quite a bright light ahead of me and not realising my lights weren't on until glancing down at the instruments and realising they are dark, because my lights weren't on. On my other car the dash lights up with the ignition so you'd never spot it!

[Peter Mallett]

It's a good point, I haven't checked whether my running lights operate the rears too, but I do find the headlights fascinating. When following another vehicle at night they appear to dip more in the middle, or where the car in front is positioned, but stay at the normal dip level each side, it means you effectively drive into a black hole.

Haven't noticed smaller indicators etc. but I do see cars with both front foglights illuminated and when turning the one on the inside goes dark.

Another solution to a problem we never had is the electronic hand brake. If it fails you have to pull the centre console apart to get to a cable.

[justracing]

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Another solution to a problem we never had is the electronic hand brake. If it fails you have to pull the centre console apart to get to a cable.

Don't go there! Mine failed around 6 months ago on my beloved Passat and it cost a kings ransom to remove and replace all for the sake of replacing a faulty sensor/relay along with the rear motors. Electronic handbrakes, completely absurd and unnecessary innovation.

[Aysedasi]

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Another solution to a problem we never had is the electronic hand brake. If it fails you have to pull the centre console apart to get to a cable.

Agreed. I've never had a car with one - nor do I want one!

[grantp]

As we pulled out of parking at Oxford Services om the M40 last Monday evening a construction company pick-up passed in front of us with front lights (quite bright but not dipped lights) and no rear lights.

Still no rear lights as we left the services following the pick-up and were delayed by the traffic lights. Some time later we caught up with it on the M40. Still no rea lights and a car in front passed him trying to warn the driver - as did we when we passed it. There was no obvious sign of any change of lighting so I suppose the driver assumed that the driving lights were dipped headlights and had no idea what people were trying to indicate.

Either that or the vehicles lights were faulty but it was being driven anyway because - "construction innit".

Then we have the entire puzzle of Automatic Lighting systems ... but that's another discussion.

[coppice]

I may have been born in 1952 but reading this thread has made me feel young . World gone mad , bloody computers , clueless young people and the rest.

Yes, modern headlamps can be a bit brighter than on a Ford Anglia but you can now actually see where you're going and the DRLs we have now are easily visible - rather more than the soft yellow glimmer you got from the Lucas sidelamps on the trusty Austin 1800..

[bauble]

Originally Posted by coppice

I may have been born in 1952 but reading this thread has made me feel young . World gone mad , bloody computers , clueless young people and the rest.

Yes, modern headlamps can be a bit brighter than on a Ford Anglia but you can now actually see where you're going and the DRLs we have now are easily visible - rather more than the soft yellow glimmer you got from the Lucas sidelamps on the trusty Austin 1800..

If one needs lights to see where you are going in daylight, it is time to tear up your driving licence.
Headlamps beams can be adjusted up/down as required, however, I suspect most 'modern' motorists turn them to maximum and leave them there, few have any respect for other road users.
Bauble 1937

[grantp]

Originally Posted by coppice

I may have been born in 1952 but reading this thread has made me feel young . World gone mad , bloody computers , clueless young people and the rest.

Yes, modern headlamps can be a bit brighter than on a Ford Anglia but you can now actually see where you're going and the DRLs we have now are easily visible - rather more than the soft yellow glimmer you got from the Lucas sidelamps on the trusty Austin 1800..

True enough but there seem to be many drivers who think that the night brightness of the DRLs means they have their dipped beams on - especially if they thought they had Auto headlights active and have a well lit up digital dash.

As for headlight level adjustments - I agree with Bob to a large degree but I suspect that any vehicles with adjustment controls that are not fully self-levelling are predisposed to people not realising they have the control available, not knowing what the settings are for and not realising that the last time they cleaned the car they accidentally changed the position of the dial.

On the other hand, I tend to support the use of the DRLs, even in what we call "daytime light" in this country. Not least because there are so many blacked out cars around that something approaching out of deep shadow can be almost invisible, which may be especially challenging at T-Junctions and crossroads.

[justracing]

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

It's a good point, I haven't checked whether my running lights operate the rears too

This was my reason for kicking off this thread, it would appear that the majority of modern day drivers in operating the day time running functionassume that their vehicle is visible both front and rear not realizing day time running lights only operate the front side lights hence they drive along in darkening/gloomy conditions totally unaware that they cannot be seen from behind.

[Gerard C]

I hardly see the point here. Daytime driving lights can be disabled and are found on modern cars which also have sensors for automatic wipers and lights. High end cars also have automatic adjusting DEL headlamps. Just read the owners manual or buy and old car and Barbie is your aunt.

[Peter Mallett]

Originally Posted by justracing

This was my reason for kicking off this thread, it would appear that the majority of modern day drivers in operating the day time running functionassume that their vehicle is visible both front and rear not realizing day time running lights only operate the front side lights hence they drive along in darkening/gloomy conditions totally unaware that they cannot be seen from behind.

Mine do operate the rears.

[Gerard C]

For those complaining about how difficult it is to check whether the rears are on or not, I found a good training with my fridge lamp…

[grantp]

I think at one time, around the point at which DDL was mandated, many cars lit up front and rear.

Now it seems the manufacturers are not bothering if rear DRL is not mandated. Indeed it may even be banned to activate the rears as part of DDL in order to make rear lights (that are not fog/poor weather lights) more likely to be brake lights when seen in good weather. Maybe not all countries have the same requirements.

[E.B]

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Mine do operate the rears.

Mine also.

[ChrisA]

Originally Posted by Gerard C

For those complaining about how difficult it is to check whether the rears are on or not, I found a good training with my fridge lamp…

Why not get out of car and look. Easy.

[Gerard C]

Originally Posted by ChrisA

Why not get out of car and look. Easy.

And, hum, about the fridge?

[grantp]

Originally Posted by ChrisA

Why not get out of car and look. Easy.

Is it not a capital offence these days to get out of the car and leave the engine running?

Best to use someone else to check the lights or look in the mirror when a reflective window or similar is behind the car.

Or, in the case of a popular model of car, just observe other cars of a similar type to see if their rear lights are on.

On the subject of lights ...

I saw a video the other day about a Hyundai vehicle on which a headlight unit related LED bulb had blown and the mechanic (USA) was seeking to replace it.

After deciding it would be easiest to remove the light unit to access the bulb he claimed to discover that the entire unit was sealed, in so far as bulb changes were concerned, and that meant that the entire light unit needed to be replaced. Apparently they cost over $1000 USD.

This seems a little strange and unlikely but not entirely unbelievable.

Does anyone have personal knowledge or experiences that would back up the story?

[ChrisA]

[QUOTE=grantp;4200924]Is it not a capital offence these days to get out of the car and leave the engine running? Just turn on ignition, all the lights will come on without the engine running.

[bauble]

By Jove, there are some very clever people on this forum.