Button vs MotoGP & Speedboat

[Led ZeppF1]

Last night I watched "MotoSport Asia" in ESPN "MotoSport Asia". In one of the segments of this news motorsport was race between F1 car (Jenson Button/BAR), motoGP and SpeedBoat.

Anybody knew about this program?

[Cee]

No I didn't know about the program.
I do know that you can find a segment of it at www.f1racing.nl
Then in the left menu click on video.
The text explaining the video's is Dutch, but the actual video is in English.
Enjoy

[Mr V]

This was on Fifth gear a month or so ago, and it wasn't a Moto GP bike, it was a British Superbike ridden by Michael Rutter iirc.

The speedboat had to have a rolling start and went across the line (where the car and bike started) at 100 mph, would have been fairer imo if all 3 went across the line at 100 mph and started the race then, but doesn't matter, the boat lost everytime

The bike won the first "race" because Jensons clutch went, but the BAR won the other 2 races convincingly doing a standing quarter in about 9 seconds (10 seconds for the bike and 13 seconds for the boat).

The most impressive thing for me was the way the BAR pulled away from the bike once they both got upto about 100 mph, incredible, they were sort of level pegging up till then.

Anyone get the chance to view it, do so, very interesting

[Peter Mallett]

Somebody once told me that a F1 engine is very low on torque but high on BHP. Your description would appear to bear that out Mr V.

[Tweed]

I assume if it had been a MotoGP bike the F1 car wouldn't have had such an advantage?

[Marbot]

The standard roadbike wouldn't have disgraced itself either,it would have quite easily beaten the boat!

[Marbot]

Originally posted by Tweed
I assume if it had been a MotoGP bike the F1 car wouldn't have had such an advantage?

The MOTOGP bikes at the Valencia GP were hitting 200mph(320kph) along it's short main straight,at Barcelona and Mugello they are even faster!

[Tweed]

I've heard on BBC MotoGP commentary that going from 5th to 6th gear on a MotoGP bike is like 2nd to 3rd on a GSX-1000. Surely the F1 car would have been beaten.

[Marbot]

At the Mugello racetrack the MOTOGP bikes have a much lower exit speed from the final corner(no downforce)than an F1 car but reach a higher top speed at the end of the straight!

[Mr V]

Originally posted by Tweed
I assume if it had been a MotoGP bike the F1 car wouldn't have had such an advantage?

Might have been closer as they were doing a standing quarter. The proper test of course would have been round a track, where the car will lap a circuit like Barcelona about 25 seconds quicker than the bike, would have been a bit difficult trying to get the boat round it though

[DSM]

Originally posted by Peter Mallett
Somebody once told me that a F1 engine is very low on torque but high on BHP. Your description would appear to bear that out Mr V.

More likely a matter of traction, I would think.

[Woolley]

It would be fairer on the boat if they had a rematch on water. It hasn't exactly got the best surface to run on.

Wasn't it Alan Jones who had a go in a pwer boat and described it as "like driving an F1 across a ploughed field"?

[Pondo]

It was really interesting - before it started, I'd have assumed that the car would have left the bike at the start because it had better grip, but the the gap would have stopped widening as the speed went up, and the car's aero started to drag. Instead, it was the exact opposite - they were level off the start, but the faster they went, the faster the gap widened.

[pirenzo]

The car is heavier of course.
It requires a greater force to get it going, but once it goes it flies.
A bike has far less air resistance, hence the higher top speed, but I doubt it approaches the F1 car in either power or torque.

[luke]

I saw it happen on Eurosport ages a go.

[Pondo]

Originally posted by pirenzo
The car is heavier of course.
It requires a greater force to get it going, but once it goes it flies.
A bike has far less air resistance, hence the higher top speed, but I doubt it approaches the F1 car in either power or torque.

The car also has a lot more rubber on the ground and traction control. I bet they have fairly similar similar power to weight ratios, but the car would have a better specific power output than Rutter's superbike. Honda could probably do an RCV with almost the same specific output as their F1 engine, I'd guess.

[Marbot]

Hondas MOTOGP engines have around 250bhp,but they never blow up unlike their F1 engines,the problem is getting all that power down through the rear tyre, many MOTOGP engines are actually run in a detuned state hence the greater reliability.

[nkh]

If anyone want's to see the Fith Gear program, it's from the episode aired on October 11th 2004, and you can download it here: http://gear.viper007bond.com/downloads.php

[Dixie Flatline]

At the Australian Grand Prix, they used to run a similar "experiment" around the track, by comparing a Formula One car against a V8 Supercar and a BMW 316i (IIRC), giving the Beemer the greatest head-start (I think, maybe up to a minute), then the V8 Supercar, then the F1 car (a BMW-WilliamsF1 piloted by Marc Gene). The Beemer always ran last, but a couple of times, the V8 completed the lap slightly ahead of the F1 car.

I think also in the Feb '04 edition of F1 racing, they put the McLaren up against the Eurofighter, but I don't remember what happened because it wasn't an interesting article to me at the time.

[Jordi]

In that article they didn't race each other. There was that Schumacher race with an Eurofighter, and also in 2000 Patrick Carpentier in a Reynard-Ford (when CART cars had a lot more power) beat a F14.

At Montmeló the Moto GP bikes are able to be up to 10-15 kph quicker than an F1 car. But of course, if you set up an F1 to go straight, with minimal downforce and all, it'll probably end up being quicker than the bike. Surely if F1 racetracks had no turns cars would probably be close to 380-390 kph.

[D_Marshall]

Originally posted by Mr V
The bike won the first "race" because Jensons clutch went, but the BAR won the other 2 races convincingly doing a standing quarter in about 9 seconds (10 seconds for the bike and 13 seconds for the boat).

Surley they were faster than that. My Formula Ford 1600 did the quater mile in 13.3 at Brighton Speed Trials this year. I watched the programme but don't recall any of the times.

Also i seem to remember the reason for the car and bike being close for the first part of the race was because the car was struggling to use all it's power without spinning it's wheels but when it got to a stage where full throttle could be used it flew.

Edited for typos

[Mattracer]

Originally posted by Dixie Flatline
At the Australian Grand Prix, they used to run a similar "experiment" around the track, by comparing a Formula One car against a V8 Supercar and a BMW 316i (IIRC), giving the Beemer the greatest head-start (I think, maybe up to a minute), then the V8 Supercar, then the F1 car (a BMW-WilliamsF1 piloted by Marc Gene). The Beemer always ran last, but a couple of times, the V8 completed the lap slightly ahead of the F1 car.

I think also in the Feb '04 edition of F1 racing, they put the McLaren up against the Eurofighter, but I don't remember what happened because it wasn't an interesting article to me at the time.

Interesting at Bathurst they had a three-way comparison between a current Commodore SS, Brocks HDT A9X Torana and a current HRT VY Commodore. The SS was quicker than the A9X and of course the HRT Commodore was quicker than both but the gains in road car development were plainly obvious. The A9X still looked pretty as a picture around Mt Panorama though...

The comparison between a Porsche road car, Honda road car and Mclaren-Honda with Senna around Estoril on the second "Inside Track" video was great viewing!