|
| Site Partners: | SpotterGuides | Veloce Books |
| Related Sites: | Your Link Here |
|
|
|||||||||
|
||||||||||
|
|
|||||||||
|
||||||||||
|
|
22 Jun 2008, 15:30 (Ref:2234804)
|
#1 | |
 Race OfficialVeteran
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 9,142
  |
Kerbs (and easy run-off areas)
This is nothing to do with the Hamilton incident, so let's leave this out of here. I was planning on making this thread ever since yesterday. But this has been bugging me in racing generally and not just F1 for a while.
What is the point of kerbs if they don't slow drivers down? They have become an extension of the race track. They should have grass next to the track, not these kerbs. I suppose they kindly mark out the edge for the drivers with bright red and white, but I'm not sure this should be something offered to the drivers. The run-off areas are also silly, and present potential problems like the aforementioned Hamilton debate. I propose getting rid of kerbs, or at least actually making them slow drivers down. In karting, many circuits have kerbs which are not quicker to run on than the track next to them. This should be the way with F1, or perhaps preferably, just do away with them like I said and have grass there. |
|
|
|
|
22 Jun 2008, 15:31 (Ref:2234805)
|
#2 | |
|
20KPINAL
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 29,853
|
High kerbs are unsafe, innit. They were the best way though.
|
|
|
|
|
22 Jun 2008, 15:39 (Ref:2234823)
|
#3 | |
|
Race Official Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 9,142
|
The problem with high kerbs though that might damage a car is that damaging a car then becomes akin to having a barrier there (an accepted challenge of street circuits).
Grass seems the ideal interim solution. You get punished by going off the circuit without (necessarily, obviously sometimes you will) damaging anything. |
|
|
|
|
|
22 Jun 2008, 15:42 (Ref:2234825)
|
#4 | ||
|
The Honourable Mallett
20KPINAL
Join Date: Feb 1999
Posts: 37,651
|
Then of course you'll need catch fencing.
|
||
|
|
__________________
I've decided to stop reaching out to people. I'm just going to contact them instead.
|
|
22 Jun 2008, 15:43 (Ref:2234826)
|
#5 | ||
|
14th
1% Club
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 44,191
|
Concrete walls and spikes.
|
||
|
|
__________________
Brum brum
|
|
22 Jun 2008, 15:45 (Ref:2234831)
|
#6 | ||
|
Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 5,493
|
Quote:
|
||
|
|
|
|
22 Jun 2008, 15:49 (Ref:2234833)
|
#7 | |
|
20KPINAL
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 29,853
|
Yes, high kerbs would damage a car, but then the idea would be to not hit them. They basically necessitate accurate driving.
I'm sure they can be made to work somehow, but they are not the easy option. |
|
|
|
|
|
22 Jun 2008, 16:06 (Ref:2234847)
|
#8 | ||
|
Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2000
Posts: 11,402
|
If there was a better solution to not using kerbs I am sure they would be using it...At the kind of speeds these cars are moving you need a visual aid for the drivers to be able to judge how far they can hang the car out..If you hit them too hard you damage the car..
I am no expert on the subject but that is my two cents... |
||
|
|
|
|
22 Jun 2008, 16:06 (Ref:2234848)
|
#9 | ||
|
Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 11,311
|
Everyone loves 20 acre tarmac run offs...
|
||
|
|
|
|
22 Jun 2008, 16:12 (Ref:2234852)
|
#10 | |||
|
Racer
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 351
|
Quote:
 Some trees as well! |
|||
|
|
|
|
22 Jun 2008, 16:19 (Ref:2234858)
|
#11 | |
|
Racer
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 131
|
I would agree with you that run off areas are maybe forgivable but i do prefer this (remeber in most case it is still a "run off" that is, you go wide) than seeing cars that go that fast in walls or spining sunddenly in the middle of a battle.
As for Kerbs, this does not disturb me. That's true in karting we can't ride the full kerbs and that exit kerbs do really slow you down but it is a matter of height of the kerbs/height of the tyre. With a race car it would be no so safe to do high kerbs. To me it makes things interesting, kerbs do change the dynamics, there's a risk of loosing control, but at the same time they offer an extra width, that's part of the racing with cars. I'm not for a unique kind of racing, so, that my kart doesn't like to ride kerbs is okay for me, in a sports car or single seater if they can...why not? You could argue on a lot of things like that, why most karts have no gear boxes?? this frees the driver from gears control, why sports car are autorized to make contact, because of their bodywork it allows the driver to be less fine on the driving and more raw etc... I don't think there's one form of racing. Last edited by Ogami musashi; 22 Jun 2008 at 16:22. |
|
|
|
|
|
22 Jun 2008, 16:41 (Ref:2234868)
|
#12 | ||
|
Race Official Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 9,142
|
Quote:
|
||
|
|
|
|
22 Jun 2008, 16:55 (Ref:2234878)
|
#13 | |||
|
Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2000
Posts: 11,402
|
Quote:
The large run offs which are being used these days I do not care for at all... |
|||
|
|
|
|
22 Jun 2008, 17:43 (Ref:2234920)
|
#14 | ||
|
Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 3,195
|
High kerbs are dangerous, as mentioned above. I remember drivers spinning at Adelaide and they went into the air due to the high kerbs.
Talking about the massive tarmac run-offs, I think we should get rid of them. They don't really slow down as long as the driver goes straight or a bit wide. Gravel traps should be better. |
||
|
|
|
|
22 Jun 2008, 17:49 (Ref:2234925)
|
#15 | |||
|
Race Official 20KPINAL
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 21,606
|
Quote:
Electric fences would be good too, they would provide immediate punishment to the driver (and car) without waiting for "under investigation" from the steward. |
|||
|
|
__________________
Show me a man who won't give it to his woman An' I'll show you somebody who will
|
|
22 Jun 2008, 17:50 (Ref:2234926)
|
#16 | ||
|
Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 2,767
|
The Massa, Kubica dust up, in Japan, at the end of last season showed how stupid these run off areas are. If you run out of road, keep on going. Although I enjoyed it - 2 racers hammering it out, thoroughly entertaining.
Looking at that, what did Hamilton do wrong today? |
||
|
|
__________________
Nostagia ain't what it used to be!
|
|
22 Jun 2008, 19:11 (Ref:2234974)
|
#17 | ||
|
Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 2,264
|
Quote:
|
||
|
|
__________________
Michael Delaney was wrong. In between is not waiting - in between is the glory, the passion. In between is what elevates racing.
|
|
22 Jun 2008, 20:00 (Ref:2235000)
|
#18 | ||
|
Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 587
|
They make the races more dramatic and increase the spectacle for the spectators, also show how close to the edge the cars and drivers are.
|
||
|
|
|
|
22 Jun 2008, 21:30 (Ref:2235078)
|
#19 | ||
|
Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 978
|
I like the idea of electric fences, but what about razer wire or large bear traps?
|
||
|
|
|
|
22 Jun 2008, 21:36 (Ref:2235082)
|
#20 | ||
|
Race Official 20KPINAL
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 21,606
|
Anything to keep them on the track is welcome...
|
||
|
|
__________________
Show me a man who won't give it to his woman An' I'll show you somebody who will
|
|
22 Jun 2008, 22:11 (Ref:2235129)
|
#21 | ||
|
Racer
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 179
|
Hell, why not go the whole hog and have a nice trench of lava around the track edge. That would work a treat I think. It would help in other areas too such as spectator safety; no worrying about debris flying into stands - if a driver screws up they just sink without trace and no more needs to be said. Turn F1 into Mario Kart, after all when has there ever been a dull MK race!?
Mmm i'm now imagining Felipe today unleashing a cunning red shell to smash Kimi's exhaust, muhah!!! Sigh i've gone too far. p.s. am I the only one imagining Lewis smashing holes into the wall of a hotel room tonight...? (seriously though, kerbs are ok, it's the get-out-of-jail-free-card tarmac run-off areas that suck) |
||
|
|
|
|
22 Jun 2008, 23:06 (Ref:2235173)
|
#22 | ||
|
Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 11,311
|
Run off area > Gravel > Lion pit...
|
||
|
|
|
|
22 Jun 2008, 23:06 (Ref:2235175)
|
#23 | ||
|
Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 5,892
|
Well, if high curbs are bad, how about those metal half-doughnuts sticking out on the inside of the curbs like they had at Mexico City and Rouen in the 1960s?
They don't need those curbs for reference; the open wheelers do just fine without them at Cleveland (now there's a circuit with NO sight references). |
||
|
|
__________________
The only certainty is that nothing is certain.
|
|
22 Jun 2008, 23:39 (Ref:2235217)
|
#24 | |
|
Retired
20KPINAL
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 22,897
|
Max has said that the run-off areas,although safe,are not in the spirit of racing.He is,as we know,looking into other forms of punishment.
|
|
|
|
|
|
23 Jun 2008, 00:24 (Ref:2235276)
|
#25 | |
|
Race Official Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 9,142
|
I don't think this question of having a specially visible outline to the track is an issue. Drivers should be able to see where the black stuff is, and even if kerbs help them locate it, it's not the kind of assistance they should really require. There's all kinds of challenges that shouldn't be made easier.
|
|
|
|
|
 |
|
|
Similar Threads
|
||||
| Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
| Those dam kerbs !! | Kirk | Formula One | 29 | 25 Apr 2005 22:55 |
| Ugly run-off areas | Sodemo | Formula One | 18 | 29 Aug 2004 19:18 |
| Brands Hatch Kerbs | McKay | Trackside | 24 | 14 Aug 2004 17:24 |
| Rockinghams Kerbs | Cynic | National & Club Racing | 57 | 12 Nov 2003 16:19 |
| Austria First Corner/ large run off areas pandering to drivers (merged) | Adam43 | Formula One | 28 | 19 May 2003 11:14 |
Linear Mode
