Most significant people and events in ten years of Supercar.

[Mattracer]

Since it's the off-season, just wondering what people consider to be the most significant happenings, people or other in ten years of the current specs?

Was it the parity debates, the inclusion of Bathurst in the Championship, the growth of street circuits, overseas races, the ownership of teams and the franchise structures, the growth of the sport as whole or anything else?

[GTRMagic]

Its 11 years actually... 12 if you count the Sandown/Bathurst 1992 where they let the new cars run for the first time.

The series is bigger, stronger, much more professional... the crowds arent significantly better, we have lost focus on any non-Supercar category, we have a load more companies from all walks of life involved in the series - not just ciggies & petrol companies....

The series is better... the cars are better... the drivers are better... the whinging and whining is the same, and about the same things... parity and sucky officialdom...

[MRJUCY]

Some of the most signicant things that come to mind

The end of the ciggie money
the change from channel 7 to 10
Brock & Johnson retiring
Lowndes & the new breed that followed him
the rise & fall of TWR
TC love him or hate him he has definately had an impact

Thats off the top of my head I'm sure I'll think of lots of other things I should have added later

[craig1]

TC

[TSR]

Good things

CH7 to CH10
FORD return to the top in 03
CARS are better looking and better designed
CLIPSAL 500
LOWDNES to Ford
A Factory Ford team


BAD THINGS

LOSE of perment circuts
PARITY
NZ race
NEW Holden motor not being run under tighter rules
BATHURST not being a stand alone race
GREG MURPHY whinging


AUSSIE BERNIE TC


This my opinon.

[Falcadore]

Since 1993? The two earliest surviving ATCC circuits in Australia Fourth and fifth respectively behind Gnoo Blas, Lowood and Longford), Mallala and Lakeside were dumped from the series, under questionable circumstances. Symmons Plains was dumped as well, the circuit thats hosted more rounds than any other. Phillip Island is gone now too. Barbagallo is hanging on by the skin of its teeth. Amaroo has been consigned to history.

[pete55]

Originally posted by Falcadore
Since 1993? The two earliest surviving ATCC circuits in Australia Fourth and fifth respectively behind Gnoo Blas, Lowood and Longford), Mallala and Lakeside were dumped from the series, under questionable circumstances. Symmons Plains was dumped as well, the circuit thats hosted more rounds than any other. Phillip Island is gone now too. Barbagallo is hanging on by the skin of its teeth. Amaroo has been consigned to history.

V8 Supercars and TC have been great for Australian Motorsport haven't they.

[devil racer nz]

TSR, the Pukekohe race certainly aint a bad thing. Maybe for you Aussies but remember this is now the biggest motorsport event in the country and it attracts record numbers of fans.

[Peter Walsh]

I thought they only went to see the NZ tourers

[racer69]

Mike Raymond/Channel 7/Shell - If it wasn't for them pushing for V8 regulations, CAMS were all set to announce FIA Class 2 rules (2 litre Super Touring) as Australia's touring Car formula for 1993.

Tony Cochrane - seemingly is happy to see other categories struggling and dieing, for the success of his. In 1996, as well as V8s, we had a strong Super Touring series, a strong AUstralian Superspeedway Championship etc... both were effectively gone within 3 years.

Removed the traditional Bathurst 1000 from the calandar, but is happy to connect the current 1000km race at Bathurst with all pre-1998 1000s and profit from the hard work and expence the ARDC and Channel 7 put in over 35 odd years, and now renders Bathurst as just another race.

He seems to think V8Supercars are more important than Australian motorsport's health in general (as shown by his obsession with street races, government backing and pointless overseas races).

1993 - We came off a dominent period for Gibson Motorsport, into a domiennt year for Glenn Seton's Peter Jackson Racing, then into a dominent 1994 for GMS.

2003 - Coming off a dominent year for HRT, into a dominent year for SBR, into a dominent year for........

And despite the increased grids (although not really by alot), increased professionalism, fake pitstops and pad changes etc.... is the racing any better today than at round 1 of the 1993 ATCC at Amaroo Park?

[Gaz170]

There's more Fords in the competition now. Ford is showing that they actually want to match Holden rather than just making a token effort.

The privateers have mostly left the main game. Even guys like Lansvale now run with some factory support and a paid driver.

[pete55]

I'm with you Racer69

[v8man]

racer69 i have to query some of your points
How can you blame TC for the demise of the super tourers and superspeedway championships, he did not stand at the gates when these championships were on and stop people from going to the races

TC did not remove the traditional Bathurst 1000 from the calender, Ch 7 refused same day coverage of all V8 races and CH 10 would but on the condition that Bathurst was included, then CH 7 as part owners of the October lond weekend refused to allow the V8s to run and ran the super tourers thinkintg they could do a Tony George (IRL) and take the crowd in the jewel and wipe out the V8's but TC then just ran the race later in the year and it was more successful then the super tourers. By the time the super tourers died a natural death the NRL started running the football grand final on a Sunday night of the long weekend so the race is now on the following weekend as there are a lot of motor racing fans in NSW/QLD that follow the football as well.

You say that he is happy to connect the current Bathurst with the 35yr tradition but the tradition became so when Holden and Ford started to battle it out for wins at Bathurst and the last time I looked the V8supercar series is Holden and Ford and you will find that this is the reason that Mike Raymond/Channel 7/Shell pushed it on us instead of the super tourers in the first place

Yes he does think that V8's are more important that AUS motorsport health in general as his job is to make and keep V8supercars at the top, not to run motorsport, that job belongs to CAMS.

Do I like TC, well he has done a lot of things that I dislike but as far as V8supercars are concerned he has done the job he was employed to do, is it time for him to move on adn get someone else, maybe or should the V8 teams via TEGA get some more bite and make him bring back established circuits and not race on as many street circuits or is it the fans fault as they say we don't want street circuits but so many say that the Clipsal 500 is the best race of the year??????

[Just Do It!]

Bloody well said, V8MAN! Why is it threads like this bring out a whole lot of piping whingers? Makes our Kiwi rockstar, Murf, sound like the legend that he is when all these bleaters come on here and piffle on about a series that they don't personally control.

I reckon Tony Cochrane is a rock star for what he has done for motorsport's profile and development in Australia. Your country, like our's, has too many segmented classes and that is to the detriment of the sport. Sure, anyone can compete at any level, but it doesn't make the sport any stronger in real terms.

By some stroke of misfortune, I picked up a copy of Auto Fiction today and actually bought it, only really for the article on the legendary Pete Geoghegan. As a consolation there was a letter from the mighty Tony himself, and it makes for compelling viewing. I can relate to his sentiments quite well.

Opportunist? Sure he is. He spotted an opportunity and ran with it and look at what we have today - Number 4 sport in Australia! No one else has ever achieved what Tony and the AVESCO team have in any other sport in this part of the world. And quite frankly, I doubt that anyone ever will.

If Supercars gets taken onto a world stage, all the better. Why not showcase what you have got? There seems to be a demand and Supercars seems to be a grand product. So test it! And in China, he will.
And do you know what? The same critics will be watching him like hawks, screeching and bleating about his every move.

If it wasn't for Tony, we wouldn't have Supercars like we have them today - 'nuff said?

TC, I admire you. It must be a bit of a "barstid" being the most scrutinised and seemingly hated man in Australian motorsport, yet the only one who has really built something that has grown rapidly and looks sustainable and exportable.

Well done fella!

[pete55]

Any one could promote the sport as well as he has done. Not sure anybody could have been such a leech on government (re our) money and the paying spectator, He promises a lot, gloats about inflated figures and really delivers little.

[racer69]

V8man - I disagree that Tony Cochrane/AVESCO don't have a duty to Australian motorsport. It certainly is not his job to look after it, but declaring war on other categories, with the aim of weakening them, like what we saw with TOCA and lately PROCAR, is just not on. He needs to realise without Australian motorsport, there is no V8Supercars (realising the importance of permanent circuits is a good start)

For all the good things AVESCO has done, the bad things clearly outweigh. While the V8s look strong, and PROCAR is getting there, after that Australian motorsport from my point of view is not in an extremely healthy state. There are a number of tracks around AUstralia rumoured to be going within the next 5-10 years, yet i haven't heard of many plans to replace them. Whether this is directly the result of AVESCO's push for street circuits and overseas races, who knows, but it has certainly played a part.

Channel 7 were as committed to the Bathurst 1000 in 1996-1998 as they had ever been. As for the championship, can you blame them for the time-slots it got? They had ratings gold with the AFL, while the V8s at the time rated not so well, except for Bathurst. Channel 10 though at the time had plenty of space in their sports line-up, they didn't have league or AFL, had just finished with the basketball, and could afford to take a risk with AVESCO. How could channel 7 have justified culling thier AFL coverage at the time, for a punt on an increase in ratings with what AVESCO had thought of doing? As we have seen in the last few years, motorsport programming on TEN has dropped with the arrivial of AFL, how long before the V8 coverage goes the same way?

With regards to Bathurst, AVESCO had no intention of the Bathurst 1000 staying the way it was. Irrespective of the watertight deal the ARDC had with 7, AVESCO had the ultimate aim of making it a round of the championship, something the ARDC had sworn they would never get involved in again. All the negotiations that went on at the time were a joke, they were never going to get anywhere. AVESCO/IMG started thier own race and therefore their own history to do with it whatever they want. The fact that it is Ford and Holden in the race doesn't matter, the first Ford/Holden only Bathurst was in 1995, and it was only between 1974 - 1978 that the ourtight class was contested solely by Holden and Ford V8s.

[Wizzby]

I think the growth of the sport in general has been positive. It's gone from a diehard petrol head only domain to a total family affair with a few interested onlookers joining in. It's not just about Bathurst anymore, and that's the way it should be. Our best drivers are starting to stay in the country that birthed (?) them and people overseas are starting to see us as serious contenders. The way the V8's have managed to grow so much, and into such an "international" series, yet still remain so close to the public amazes and makes me proud. Motorsport in Australia used to be a dry patch in our sporting prowess, but we've shown that we can mix it with the big guys, and in the future I think we'll show we can do it better (that is if Tony either grows a brain or steps down :P)

[mountainstar]

If you contrast now with 10 years ago there is no comparison. I see some problems that can be fixed, but look at how big the industry is today.

A lot of people have criticized avesco for strong arming permanent circuits to improve their facilities or else. The street races attract huge corporate support and fans. I'd rather be in downtown Adelaide than Mallala anyday.

[promax]

what i don't understand is... if the v8 supercars series is sooo bad.. why do the people that constantly complain about it still watch every single race and spend hours ***** about it in forums like this one?

the v8 supercar series isn't perfect. but it is a lot better then the **** nz motorsport fans have had to put up with over the last 8-10 years :P

[Timu]

1993......
Grids with 2litre cars, Sprint rounds, Ch7 call, Cheaper tickets and food, oily rags, HRT selling hats off the back of a truck, Ciggerete money, Good racing....

2003......
Bigger grids, better events, Professional teams and drivers, slick telecast, 30 cars in a one second bracket! HRT selling anything and everything, TC/Avesco, various sponsors, Better racing...

THE BIGGEST DIFFERENCE IS....

1993 Shell Series:

Rd 1 Amaroo Park
Rd 2 Symmons Plains
Rd 3 Phillip Island
Rd 4 Lakeside
Rd 5 Winton
Rd 6 Eastern Creek
Rd 7 Mallala
Rd 8 Barbagallo
Rd 9 Oran Park

2004 Shell Series:

Rd 1 Adelaide
Rd 2 Eastern Creek
Rd 3 Pukekohe, NZ
Rd 4 Hidden Valley
Rd 5 Barbagallo
Rd 6 Queensland
Rd 7 Winton
Rd 8 Oran Park
Rd 9 Sandown 500
Rd 10 Rd 11 Bathurst 1000
Rd 11 Surfers Paradise
Rd 12 Shanghai, China
Rd 13 Eastern Creek

[DNQ]

Interesting that only four races from 1993 will be on the 2004 Calendar. Quite sad really.

Well ... the biggest moments:

1992 - Bathurst/Sandown - debut of the V8 racing cars
1993 - First Season of V8 supercars
1993-1999 - TOCA/AVESCO battles
1997 - Switch to Channel 10 coverage
1999 - Launch of Adelaide V8 Supercar round
1999-2002 - Parity issues, Project Blueprint etc
1999-2002 - No V8 Sandown 500
2003 - Ford win the series - VY/BA debuts

General:

- Grice/Crompton/Longuhst/Brock/Perkins/Johnson/Richards/ etc retire from full time V8 racing, ushering in a new era of stars.
- Increasing commercialisation of the series.
- The TWR empire.
- Loss of cigarette sponsorship.
- Bathurst given Championship status
- Loss of Shell title sponsorship

[Peregrine]

2004 Shell Series Timu ? The point I would like to make is that there is no longer a naming rights series sponsor.... What other "top line" sport has managed such a feat since 1993 ?

[Mattracer]

Influential people:

Tony Cochrane
TWR
Brock/Johnson retiring, others becoming once a year steerers paving the way for the younger generation

Influential events/milestones:

parity squabbles
team ownerships/franchises
TV coverage
no ciggie money
merchandise spinoffs gaining momentum
controversy surrounding driving ettiquette
street circuits

It's interesting to see the timeline of the series since 1992/3 and how things have evolved.

[brno86]

Racer69 is right on the money. Mike Raymond was very influential behind the formation of the series and really had some vision when the ATCC was in freefall. As much as I disagree with his politics ,Tony C has brought the series into the average persons house whether it be print or TV.For MOTORSPORT in general it has been good news. Tonys stance then double back flip with pike on Wanneroo would have to be a highlight!

[Mattracer]

Does PI get another go if China doesn't happen?