When does stop mean stop?

[Ed-f1]

BAR driver, Ricardo Zonta stopped his Honda powered machine on the side of the track during Friday's free practice session, however it wasn't due to a mechanical fault but rather for a more curious reason.

The Brazilian had spun off the circuit just moments before and managed quite well to put the BAR back on track, however just after he got going again, his engineer emphasised over the radio that he must come into the pits to have his car checked out.

Normally this wouldn't have been a problem as many drivers do just that after a spin, however Zonta was having a little trouble with his radio communication and was unable to hear the instruction clearly, so the engineer repeated the request loudly.

"You must stop, you must stop." So the Brazilian did what he was told immediately and pulled off onto the grass and ... stopped.

[Jay]

Is that what having so many large accidents does to a driver?

[fatbloke]

Maybe he thought it was god telling him to call it a day driving for BAR

[Ralf's Girl]

Let's expand that thought, fatbloke, and make it STOP DRIVING IN F1, YOU LOSER.

[Liz]

Leaving aside the juvenile sarcasm of the last post, here are a few things that you should consider when speculating about why Zonta stopped as he did.

The radio was acting up. He had to act on the part of the message that he heard, not the part that he did not hear. Obviously you lot are gifted with mind reading abilities or extraordinary hearing that enable you to hear information from the pits without recourse to the radio.

If you are driving a race car that has a habit of giving you high speed rides into walls and over fences because pieces of it break, and someone yells YOU MUST STOP, perhaps he knows something about the car that you don't know, i.e. that it is about to burst into flames, some important piece has given warning that it is about to break or has already done so, and your life may be endangered if you don't stop immediately.

Similarly, the person yelling at you may be warning you about something that has happened further up the track that you can't see and that may endanger you if you don't stop immediately. (Remember Juan Montoya smashing into the back of Helio's car when it was stuck into the wall, because he ignored or misinterpreted the warnings he was getting on the radio?)

Finally, Zonta does not speak very good English. If you were driving an F1 car at speed and someone was yelling commands at you in Portuguese, it is entirely possible that you would miss at least part of what they were saying.

Stop jeering at Zonta for doing something that made perfect sense in the circumstances, and think for once.

[Ralf's Girl]

My comment wasn't actually aimed at that particular incident. Expand that to various other incidents...(I bear grudges!)

[Bononi]

I am concerned about Zonta's future in F1. It was a bad move going to BAR. Altough I think JV is one of the best drivers in the field, his position in the team made Zonta's life very hard. I think he deserves a chance in some other team where he can try a better performance. That is not the same for Diniz in my opinion.

[Ralf's Girl]

Zonta perhaps wasn't aware when he signed for BAR that he would be clearly just the driver of the second car. With the close relationship between Jacques Villeneuve and Craig Pollock, it's unsurprising that he perhaps hasn't had quite the same opportunity as he might have in another team.

[Liz]

Don't judge Zonta solely by what he has done on a horrible team with no support. Would you judge Zanardi's entire career solely on the miserable failure he was (in two separate tries for two separate teams) in Formula One? And I have heard people say that Michael Andretti should not be condemned as a nearsighted whiney-hiney mobile chicane solely on the basis of the 10 race tryout his father got for him in 1993.

Zonta has been a champion in every other formula in which he has driven, and he will be brilliant once he gets out of this current situation. It's too soon to start yelling "Loser" at somebody just barely 23 years old.

[Ralf's Girl]

But perhaps some of the things Zonta has done could have been avoided. I wouldn't judge Zanardi's entire career on last season, but that's how you judge his F1 career. And this is how I judge Zonta - not by the other championships he's raced in. I'm looking at F1, where he probably hasn't been as successful and a lot of people had hoped or expected. I understand that last year, he suffered in the same way as Villeneuve with the unreliable car, but this season, some silly mistakes have cost him (and not only him) points.

[fatbloke]

What's that Liz ? Like you don't judge Button ? Whatever

[Liz]

People a lot older and more experienced than Zonta have made silly mistakes, this year and every year. Like some German bloke in a Ferrari last weekend - and in the last race of 1997 - and in the last race of 1999 - and in Montreal 1998 when he rammed Frenzy off the track in his zeal to exit the pits - Frenzy being on the track and on the racing line at the time - and said "I didn't see him" ... and his excursion into the wall in Montreal in 1999 ... and his running up the bootlid of DC in Spa and then screaming that DC was trying to kill him ... Zonta has made silly mistakes, but not as many as most rookies make, and he has not tried to pretend that he didn't make them, or blatantly blamed other people for them either.

Wait and see what he does in a decent team where people support him before you brand him a loser. Even Mika raced several years before he so much as got his first win, much less had any kind of chance at a championship.

[Ralf's Girl]

It's worth remembering that Hakkinen didn't win (properly) until he was driving the best car. I wonder, now that he's spent two seasons driving in a team who are not concerned with his doing well, whether or not he will ever get that kind of opportunity.

By the way, it's nice to be able to have a sensible debate about something even when you have differing opinions, unlike other forums where people seem to think you're completely in the wrong for not sharing their opinion (I'm not going to mention which one, but I can tell you that I've had some stick for disagreeing with people's opinions about TGF).

[GridGirl]

Hey Ralf's Girl!!!!! I agree totally!!!!!!!! Some Aleged fans just salg you if you dont share the same opinion!!!!!!! We should have the right to a sensible debate!!!!!! If they feel the need to argue the obviously aint real fans!!!!

[Mr.S]

Just wondering, how many times has Zonta actually failed to finnish due to his own fault, besides Germany. If I remember correctly it seems the car usually lets him down. I may be wrong though.

[Bononi]

R Girl you're right. Hakkinen is a winner in a great car. But remember that, he is skilled enough to drive fast and not make mistakes. In this way he is the current champion and deserves that. I don't think he is in the same level as Schumacher, or all the great drivers of the past. But even a mighty car like McLaren must be driven by a skilled driver.
If we focus on the current grid, I would not pay (?) for another season with Diniz. He has not improved so much all these years, and just switched through the middle teams My point is that he is experienced enough to make such mistakes. Ok, we all could say is bad luck and other things but really ? I remember Martin Brundle that always seemed to be promising (he challenged Senna in F3, if my memory serves me well) but never got to make it. So, I can remember Hill leading a race and almost wining it in a Arrows, and who was his teammate ? Diniz...
This only shows that if you got some conditions to make a great race, and you are skilled, you do it !

[Minardi fan]

Zonta needs a friendly team such as Minardi or Jordan to help him develop into the excellent driver he has the potential to be. Being at BAR is giving him no chance.

[Dino IV]

Not even Hockenheim was really his fault, Mr. S.
Zonta was going great, stayed out on slicks and had no problem whatsoever in the stadium to keep his laptimes up to pace - probably heading for the podium at that time - when Villeneuve on wets took the inside line at the first corner and went wide where ... Zonta accelerated normally off the dry line. JV touched and spun due to his own manouver and cried whole BAR together about what a lousy collegue Zonta was not to let his mentor by ...
Finally Zonta recieved a stop-and-go penalty after all that whining ... a stop-and-go his race-engineer so cautiously told him about at a great position on the track ... just when braking down from 5th entering the hairpin in the motodrome ... on slicks ... in the wet ... on your way to your first F1-podium. I bet no-one would have made that corner under those circumstances.

They need a grand ol' man at BAR that's for sure - and not JV's former gymteacher- to point out who's leading the team. Just to make decisions in times like that and get to grips with the megalomanic cry for untouchability by JV and make him clear for once and for all that BAR enters TWO cars every GP and that BOTH should be get to maximum performance.
The same thing a little guy called Todt could learn a lot from.

All heard about the Koni-gate at BAR this weekend?
Seems as if Koni developed a new suspension set for the BAR.
JV ran with those on friday; Zonta didn't. He didn't even know about the new dampers when someone told him by accident. 'Hey Ricardo! What do you think of the new Koni's?''Huh? What new Koni's?' Anyway, he went for some clearification, why he wasn't equipped with those and they gave him the magnificent explanation: 'Because you didn't ask for them!'

No, it's great fun running next to JV at BAR, really great fun ... almost as much as fun as running next to TGF at Ferrari. Really the position you wanna be in and great careerbuilding too. No one will blame you for being patronised time after time by your teamboss and his mate, your collegue and pulling the short stroke everytime. Everyone knows you simply can't win that battle.

Except at a forum now and then.

[Liz]

Absolutely and amen! I'm glad somebody has faith in Zonta besides me. He will be great some day. And some day people will say, "Who was that bloke that drove with Zonta his first two years? Jack somebody?"

Fatbloke, I don't judge Button. I don't LIKE Button because he seems to me to be a hollodw little PR machine, and I am not afraid to say so, but I haven't said anything that I recall about his actual racing.

Finally, everyone has the right to defend his or her opinions and/or pilot with great vigour and earnestness and I hope we all keep on doing so.

[EERO]

Liz, (yes, I'm back) I've been saying for ages that I think Zonta is a potential great-and there is no way he could ever show it at BAR given the team's bias toward JV.

I'm with you, in five or six years, Zonta will be a real threat for the WDC.

[Valve Bounce]

Pedro and Ricardo are in this Skoda going down a steep hill when Ricardo discovers the brakes don't work.
Ricardo: Hey Pedro!! The car won't stop, I have no brakes!!
Pedro: Don't worry Ricardo, there is a STOP sign at the bottom of the hill!!

[Ralf's Girl]

Originally posted by GridGirl
Hey Ralf's Girl!!!!! I agree totally!!!!!!!! Some Aleged fans just salg you if you dont share the same opinion!!!!!!! We should have the right to a sensible debate!!!!!! If they feel the need to argue the obviously aint real fans!!!!

Welcome to 10/10ths, GridGirl!

I don't want to cause arguments, but perhaps,Zonta is similar to Ralf or Frentzen, in the respect that he needs the right environment to perform at his top level. The way Ralf has a better atmosphere at Williams than at Jordan, and Frentzen the other way round. Zonta may need a more relaxed atmosphere in his team, and a team willing to give him more support than he is getting at Team Villeneuve - sorry, BAR.

[Liz]

Hi, Eero, welcome back! Wouldn't you love to see Zonta and Helio racing together for McLaren?

[Super Tourer]

This team atmos thing is much bigger than some pople think.


Ralf didn't gel in the 'matey' Jordan team, yet has fitted in perfectly at the 'cold' Williams Team. By the way, my claim to fame is that I was called on my mobile by Frank Williams. I was driving home from a meeting when he called me, I nearly drove off the road !!! I can bore you with the whole story if you request......

Anyway, Frentzy was the reverse to the above. With Zonta you could argue that its all BAR's fault....Using them as an example, you have to wonder about the wisdom of 'building' a team around one driver, who in JV's case nearly left the team....

JV had them by the balls and was able to use other teams as a negotiating tool. If the no 2 driver is treated as a poor relation and not given the conditions to perform well and the 'star' drivers goes off on the first lap, you are heading for no points.

Whatever anybody says about Ron Dennis, his two cars are fighting for the series, both his drivers in the top 3 and leading the constructors. Where are BAR and that is why Honda have effectively 'dumped' them as a sole works team.

BAR had a huge opinion of themselves before the car had even turned a wheel,massively overspent and are losing sponsors.......Time to wise up guys.

[Ralf's Girl]

BAR in 99 completely overestimated the abilities of the car they had built. Craig Pollock actually said they would win their first race. Now, they should start treating both drivers fairly if they want to get the best results they are capable of.

I would be interested to know how you ended up being phoned by Sir Frank Williams...?