which model of 1989 vauxhall cavalier, would match up to a 1989 BMW 325i

[Mike Sheraton]

hi guys, as the title suggests, which car could i use that would match up to a BMW 325I on performance and handling once both race prepared.
thanks in advance.

[neiltb]

I don't think they made one, a 320i you might have a shot with a GSI but there's no replacement for displacement.

[phoenix]

Originally Posted by neiltb

I don't think they made one, a 320i you might have a shot with a GSI but there's no replacement for displacement.

Or six cylinders, rear wheel drive, an LSD........ the list goes on

Get a 325 - it's the only way to go!

[GORDON STREETER]

An ex BTCC Cavalier might do it !

[phoenix]

Originally Posted by GORDON STREETER

An ex BTCC Cavalier might do it !

mmm - there's a point.

[Tim Wilkinson]

Why use the Cavalier? Same C20XE engine in the Mk2 Astra GTE, you can get them for peanuts, engine very tunable, and loads of bits available, and lighter than the Cav.

I'm completely ignorant (through choice, for a change!) on BMWs, so have no idea what the 325 is like.

[phoenix]

Originally Posted by Tim Wilkinson

I'm completely ignorant (through choice, for a change!) on BMWs, so have no idea what the 325 is like.

http://www.carfolio.com/specificatio...car/?car=56331

[Tim Wilkinson]

I meant more along the lines of cost effective tunability.

on performance and handling once both race prepared.

It also depends how much weight you're allowed to shed. Race-prepared is the key - and budget is the key factor in that.

[Mike Sheraton]

even though that is great, can anyone tell me what kind of power/torque, etc that the 325i has standard as on that it only says maximum, or is that standard?

[Notso Swift]

Look up BWM E30 racing in Australia, there a one make serices based on the 325i

HERE IS A LINK www.e30racing.com.au

THey are NOT fully race modified but they are prepared within their rules, they need to use standard components like inlets, heads, compression and factory computer. (but they have been known to cheat )
They have about 200 hp at the flywheel
Some people have mod'ed and they pull about 260 hp with thottle bodies, computers, cams. I think there is a conversion using the diesel crank that makes them about 2.7 litres, no more power, but better average torque. This is fairly cost effective as a lot of the parts are available
If you go all out (and I know one bloke who has) they will give about 110 per litre in race trim (ie reliable) I think he is about 2.9 litres with custom crank, custom everything, actually!
Of course the best E30 BMW to use is also 2.5 litres, but it only has 4 cyl...

A full house XE motor will get the same power as the BMW from 2 litres (320 hp), and you will be effectively looking at a BTCC motor, but running to about 9500 rpm. because of the revs it will cost MEGA and rebuilds will be common because you will be looking a lightweight forged slipper pistons with really skinny rings, steel crank and rods, biggest valves you can get, titanium top end a cams up over 300 degrees. Oh and you will be looking at dry sumping as well... so that would be about 12-4k GBP (I am guessing you are in the UK)
If you keep the XE to reasonable power you can buy upgrade kits, around 200 only requires a computer, exhaust and throttle bodies
(bigger cams require new pistons, then you can push to about 240 before the rods need doing, then to about 270 is the limit for the crank)

Then it comes to the chassis... an Astra is going to have a serious weight advantage over everything else, the cavalier will also have an advantage. But the BM has rear drive so is asking less from each of the tyres

[terence]

The Swindon built engine we used in Clellands 95 Cavalier cost £27,000 just to give some idea on BTCC engines.

[Mike Sheraton]

i assume by the term we, you worked on it?
would be great to hear from your experiences

[GORDON STREETER]

Originally Posted by Mike Sheraton

i assume by the term we, you worked on it?
would be great to hear from your experiences

I think he cleaned the bogs and made the tea

[Al Weyman]

Mike forget it you are wasting your time and money. I used to have this all the time, guys for example wanting to bring out a Mk3 Escort when they could use exactly the same running gear in a Fiesta, just what is the point or a 1300cc Metro instead of a Mini. I tried to advise them but those that would not listen turned out and got no where as predicted. The fastest Cavalier I saw at our level (forget BTCC as thats on another plain) was Dave Wileman's ModProd turbo version which if you really did want to run a Cavalier that would possibly be the one to go for as at least it had the advantage of the turbo which the Astra did not, however you better have some deep pockets! Also was the Turbo version 4WD or did it also come as 2WD?

[GORDON STREETER]

I suppose it depends on whether you buy a car already prepped. If you are planning on building the car yourself, as there is a mountain of Vauxhall performance gear kicking about and also the engine is a good reliable one, I would agree with Al and go the Astra route. Of course if you for some reason must have a Cavalier then I wish you well . I hope its not just because you happen to have one laying about !

[G.Walker]

The turbo version was 4x4, made between 92 and 94
http://www.cavalierturbo.com/

[Al Weyman]

BTW it was Derek that had the Cavalier Turbo not Dave. Yes something at the back of my mind said it was 4x4, we did allow 4x4's.

[Al Weyman]

We also had a Calibra coupe out with us that looked stunning but again the Astra was lighter with the same running gear. With the turbo I also recollect it had quite a small turbo charger.

[R59]

Put a LS1/2/6/7/9 in it!!! That's my solution.

[Notso Swift]

Originally Posted by terence bower

The Swindon built engine we used in Clellands 95 Cavalier cost £27,000 just to give some idea on BTCC engines.

How much of that do you think went into IP and the Reverse head
Competition is a wonderful thing, so is not having to re-invent the wheel

One of the questions I have is actually along the line of "stick a V8 in it" (never that bad an idea) what are the class rules for re-engine? If you are allowed to (say) swap to the same manufature then you will often find something within the same range
E30 BMW with the best 6 in the BMW range, that would be the 3.2 M3 motor, more than 100 bhp/litre stock

Jimmy Mcrae use to rally a Calibra 4x4
Pretty sure the turbo is a T25 (which is small) about 240 hp, but the same bolt on patternt as a T2860 which are rated up to about 360 hp

[Al Weyman]

We had a fellow from Nottingham bring out a 3 series in modprods with that 6 cylinder lump shoehorned in, stunning looking and performing car. Sadly it came to light they only made a handful in South Africa and the car ws deemed illegal. Actually I see one the other day an Alpina version as they also did the conversion in Europe in a mates yard that had a bit of repairable accident damage to the front.

[terence]

Originally Posted by Notso Swift

How much of that do you think went into IP and the Reverse head
Competition is a wonderful thing, so is not having to re-invent the wheel

One of the questions I have is actually along the line of "stick a V8 in it" (never that bad an idea) what are the class rules for re-engine? If you are allowed to (say) swap to the same manufature then you will often find something within the same range
E30 BMW with the best 6 in the BMW range, that would be the 3.2 M3 motor, more than 100 bhp/litre stock

Jimmy Mcrae use to rally a Calibra 4x4
Pretty sure the turbo is a T25 (which is small) about 240 hp, but the same bolt on patternt as a T2860 which are rated up to about 360 hp

In fact,the head reversal was not that significant in cost,quite a straightforward mod. From choice I'de go for the BM with the promise of a fair bit more torque on offer.

[andy97]

Originally Posted by Mike Sheraton

hi guys, as the title suggests, which car could i use that would match up to a BMW 325I on performance and handling once both race prepared.
thanks in advance.

It must depend a bit on the regs for the series concerned - ie how much can the car be modified from standard. What series are you looking at racing in? I'm assuming that in the series that you are looking at the BMW is already the class of the field, but you actually have a Cavalier that you are wishing to prepare? Probably cheaper to just sell the Cav & buy a similar Bee Em!