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3 Nov 2007, 17:14 (Ref:2058697) | #1 | |
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New stock car series in Holland
Next season Dutch National Racing Team (DNRT) organisation starts a new stock car series for gentlemen drivers in Holland. There are planned 7 endurance races (around 3 hours, if wanted car can shared by 2 drivers). The car costs around € 50,000 (ex VAT).
Chassis: Nascar type spaceframe Body: Nascar Late Model Engine: Corvette LS2 V8 aluminium, 6L, fuel injection Power: 450 bhp (550 Nm) at 6500 rpm Weight: 1050 kg Top speed: Around 330 km/h Rims: Steel, 10 X 15 Tires: Hoosier slicks 10 x 15 Dampers: Intrax Suspension Rear axle: Aluminium "Tiger" Noise: 89db under full power Dimensions: L 5.50 m, W 2.0 m, H 1.20 m They expect a lap time at Zandvoort around 1.50m. More photos |
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3 Nov 2007, 18:10 (Ref:2058729) | #2 | ||
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Looks great! Iwish i could run one but, unfortunatly, im not a Gentleman! Why are they so expensive though?
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3 Nov 2007, 23:10 (Ref:2058912) | #3 | ||
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Why only 450 hp. We had 650 hp in our Trans Am series car back in 2000.
I do like the car though and hope the series makes a go of it. |
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3 Nov 2007, 23:32 (Ref:2058926) | #4 | ||
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Simple answer - whats the point? CAMSO V8 runs next door in Belgium, with similar cars at a huge amount less.
Why on earth do people want to run late model stock cars on road courses? they are rubbish - want good racing on a road course S2000 touring cars - more extreme? DTM These things keep coming up - this time last year a similar concept was launched by Jochen Mass - what happened to that? Speedcar is only working as some arabs are pouring money in. I can't see this working Last edited by ss_collins; 3 Nov 2007 at 23:36. |
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3 Nov 2007, 23:32 (Ref:2058927) | #5 | ||
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4 Nov 2007, 10:59 (Ref:2059213) | #6 | ||
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You can't compare this series to Jochen Mass' ASCE or Speedcar. The DNRT events are mainly for the drivers self (club racing) and not for the public or media. They run series for old Volvo 360 to Sakers. They are very succesful (large grids, relative low costs). Why only 450hp? To keep noise under 89db? To keep costs down? Safety reasons? |
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4 Nov 2007, 12:01 (Ref:2059237) | #7 | ||
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There is actually no reason these cars can't run with the CAMSOs if they wanted to. (same as the SCSA). I have to say i am a bit miffed they didn't come and ask us first. We could have built them cheaper cars and maybe we could have worked together in some way. I tell you, if everyone in Europe that was trying to start an American stockcar series sat in one room at the same time and worked on it together, it would be awsome.
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4 Nov 2007, 15:51 (Ref:2059350) | #8 | ||
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I know the concept and I´m pretty sure they will get this going next year. But as said before this is not for the public, it´s club racing for amateurs. And unlike the British club scene people here don´t show up to watch it, coz basically only Zandvoort has it.
I wish they would start a decent real low cost stockcar series that can run the various ovals (or dirt) that we have in The Netherlands and Belgium. Every time we build an oval we decide to trash it up with bangers. IMO bangers should be forbidden and stockcar F1/F2 can be stolen too. Those cars look like bumper cars and the racing is lackluster. Create some low cost series like Late Model, Midgets, Sprint or Street Stock and get them racing. It´s entertaining and the Americans don´t go to their local tracks on Saturdaynight for nothing. |
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4 Nov 2007, 16:19 (Ref:2059362) | #9 | |||
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4 Nov 2007, 17:35 (Ref:2059389) | #10 | |||
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Although I've never been to Warneton I think its a great facility. Probably the best short track in Europe. Sadly it's a bit too far away from me to visit. Maybe I should have explained myself a little bit better. It's just that in America they have all sorts of series and it's really quite popular. Then in Holland we have some ovals but only run Stockcar F1/F2 on it and some banger stuff. Yes, I'm aware there are some other series racing on them. But its just not as big as it could be. And I just can't understand bangers. These people put a lot of work in their cars to just see them get smashed up (not to speak of the danger aspect). I would rather see these old cars go racing against each other and the winner gets some real money, that would prevent them from entering all those cars into banger events. Oval racing just has it all. Fans can see the whole track, drivers and equipment are never far away from average joe, close racing and lots of passing. Only thing in Holland that comes close to it is the Dutch round of the FIA Rallycross championship, which always has great action and a great atmosphere. If you're familiar with the event you will understand. |
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4 Nov 2007, 18:39 (Ref:2059444) | #11 | |||
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As Kelvin says - you want to see that kind of car racing in Holland - just tell CAMSO where they should turn up... |
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4 Nov 2007, 19:07 (Ref:2059460) | #12 | ||
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HCForums, The problem is that contact formula and Bangers is what people want, weather we like it or not. Bangers pay for our racing. If we have a meeting at Warneton with no contact formulas, the grandstands are half empty. That is an unfortunate fact but a fact non the less. It is changing though! The CAMSO V8s have a few hardcore fans who really love the racing and that fan base is growing all the time. As i said before though and ss_collins reittirated, if there is somewhere you can suggest that is suitable for our racing near you, i will talk to the promoter and we will see if we can sort something out.
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5 Nov 2007, 18:58 (Ref:2060488) | #13 | ||
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Didn't know that, as I said I've never been to an oval so I have no idea what the scene is like.
Have you guys ever talked to the people over at Venray Speedway? That's the only oval I know in the Southern part of Holland. |
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5 Nov 2007, 19:44 (Ref:2060521) | #14 | ||
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5 Nov 2007, 19:53 (Ref:2060529) | #15 | ||
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Last edited by tony s; 5 Nov 2007 at 20:02. |
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5 Nov 2007, 22:08 (Ref:2060619) | #16 | ||
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Tony S, how fast is the sprint car compared to the F1? Will they run their own series next year at Venray?
I've been through the BRL paddock three times this year but have not run into that one. |
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6 Nov 2007, 18:01 (Ref:2061371) | #17 | |||
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Has the same motor as the BRl V6 , only 25 HP more . The Sprintcar had the same tyre´s on as the Stockcar F1 , no slicks. Its the intention that this class goes of start next year. ( Venray ) Will well a new class become for the new oval, that as I heard , will be 1 KM long . Sorry for my bad English . Last edited by tony s; 6 Nov 2007 at 18:06. |
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6 Nov 2007, 18:06 (Ref:2061375) | #18 | ||
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Looks great! Can't help wonder why they didn't just make them V8 though.
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6 Nov 2007, 18:17 (Ref:2061384) | #19 | ||
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6 Nov 2007, 18:49 (Ref:2061412) | #20 | ||
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Going back to a comment earlier it would be great if all the promoters in europe sat down and tried to sort out a proper europe stock car series and from what ive seen lately base it on the camso's.
Great racing at lydden this year and begs the question when are they going to be let loose on rockingham? |
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7 Nov 2007, 16:30 (Ref:2062251) | #21 | |||
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Rockingham - 1.5 speedway Eurospeedway - 2.0 superspeedway Warneton - 0.3 short track The rumoured 1km oval that tony s mentioned - 0.6 short track Lydden has been used as a road course, other potential road courses could be Silverstone National, and maybe the Nring sprint track (using the smoother chicane that the trucks use) The Nascar regional series (West, East, Canada and Mexico) are switching to the same car next year (iirc). They are effectively spec cars with different branded bodyshells, and the chassis are adaptable enough to eliminate the need for track specific cars. If you could set up a decent european championship using these cars then Nascar will soon come knocking. With what i've read here of the sprintcar racing in Holland and Camso V8 there is certainly the grassroots thats needed. |
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7 Nov 2007, 23:42 (Ref:2062552) | #22 | |||
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I'd love to see them at Rockingham, but technically, it ain't gonna happen. There are lots of people who want to see this kind of racing in Europe, it's just that there are so many differences of opinion. It all needs pulling together, and that is where the issue lies - who? Brian France said back in August that NASCAR would talk to like minded people in Europe, if those like minded people in Europe talked to NASCAR. Before you talk to NASCAR, make sure that you have the right product on the table, or they will smile politely and say "no thanks". So far, nobody has had the right product. And to my mind, none of what we have comes anywhere near it. The reason why everything fails is because nothing fit's their model of "how to do it". 1. Merchandising, 2. Public Perception/support, 3. Motor Racing. In that order. I wish our friends in Holland the best success with their venture. Just don't try running those crate LS2's on an oval. They'll go bang. |
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8 Nov 2007, 20:30 (Ref:2063334) | #23 | ||
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We could race there Trist, we even have the gearing to do so (though you would need a serious pace car!)
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9 Nov 2007, 16:16 (Ref:2063863) | #24 | ||
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Im a bit confused Kevin because you are saying you can race at Rockingham and Rob is saying you cant!
It just frustrates me so much that there is not a top line series in europe. I realise that we lack tracks but i seem to remember that Gavin Wills had a idea of racing at air bases as they effectly have large oval and there is lots of those in europe. I just wonder if it might be worth having some sort meeting during the off season involving the top brass in oval racing in europe? |
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9 Nov 2007, 20:24 (Ref:2063997) | #25 | ||
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Rob has spoken to Roland and it would appear Roland has said we can't. I don't know why and it doesn't really matter. I have discussed this at length with Gary and Tony (Roots V8 Racing) and I assure you we can run it. The problem is it is not an exercise worth doing unless you have a high car count (25 to 30 but ideally 43!) Then, we would have to look at making the event free to enter. (CAMSO V8 drivers are very tight and dont like entry fees!) The cars would need some modifications to the chassis and the way the bodywork is mounted but thats only a time issue. If the track is open for testing next year, we might pop a car in there to try it out and see what we learn. But even if that went ok, i'm fear you are a long way of seeing CAMSO race there. The championship is guaranteed to grow by at least two cars a year so worst case senario, you looking at 6 years until we get 30 cars. Rockingham will probably be gone by then! Air bases are ok but not very spectator friendly. Infact I have seen Rallies on them where there was no spectators allowed at all! As for your final idea, yes it would be worth it, now tell us how to make it happen!
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