MRL HTCC eligibility changes & New Gr1 Trophy

[chunterer]

The MRL is going to permit normally aspirated Group A cars up to 1990 from this season.

Hmm...It will attract more cars, E30 M3's obviously spring to mind, but it's a bit controversial. .

Why not go the whole hog and let the RS Cosworth in?

The series will also have a new Gr1 cup within the existing main series called the Tony Dron Trophy. I'm guessing that will aim to attract more of the Goodwood MM entrants that only come out once or twice a year?

There's positives with all if this for sure but also a few question marks. The Group A thing kind of flies in the face of what they were patiently achieving with the pre86 non homologation specials aims?

[Mike Bell]

The detail hasn't reached MRL's website yet, so the following is copied from emails received-

"Motor Racing Legends has announced that we are extending eligibility for this year’s Historic Touring Car Challenge. (HTCC)

This popular series for Historic Touring Cars will be extending the entry regulations to include Group A cars right up to December 1990 – to cover normally-aspirated cars; and smaller capacity turbo-charged cars. The Historic Touring Car Challenge, entering its sixth season in 2016, has traditionally filled grids with cars from the British and European Touring Car Championships from 1966 right up to 1985. The Group 1, Group 2 and Group A eras include a mixture of Ford Capri, Triumph Dolomite Sprints, TWR XJS and Rover Vitesses. But the grid extension will now also open the doors for newcomers such as BMW M3, Toyota Corolla and Astra GTEs, all of which will now be eligible to compete.

This year the Historic Touring Car Challenge season opens at the prestigious Donington Historic Festival (April 30-May 2) before making its debut stand-alone appearance at Silverstone Classic (July 29-31) followed by a visit to Spa during the Six Hour Endurance weekend (Sept 16 -18). Rounding off the year with a weekend in Portimao for the Algarve Classic Festival. (Oct 28-30)"

And the Gp1 Trophy info-

"To be named the ‘Tony Dron Trophy’ - in honour of the ‘70s Touring Car ace and Le Mans sports car driver Tony Dron – the new series is for Touring Cars running to FIA Group 1 regulations or to British Saloon Car Championship ‘Group 1½’ regulations between 1970 and 1982. Tony, a familiar face around historic race paddocks, remains a highly respected driver to this day and regular writer in the historic motorsport press.

The overall winner of the Tony Dron Trophy each year will be awarded the actual trophy presented to Tony for winning the Tricentrol British Saloon Car Championship support race at the British Grand Prix in 1977 – the year that Dron missed out on the Championship by a single point. The Tony Dron Trophy will run within Motor Racing Legends’ Historic Touring Car Challenge grid, with its own podium and results for each race. The new class structure and trophy announcement comes after last week’s press announcement extending the class structure for the Historic Touring Car Challenge to include Group A cars right up to December 1990."

[Mike Bell]

Maybe there's nothing more to discuss on this, but it got buried by soon after initial post, so deserves another chance!

[Peter Mallett]

Originally Posted by Mike Bell

The detail hasn't reached MRL's website yet, so the following is copied from emails received-

"Motor Racing Legends has announced that we are extending eligibility for this year’s Historic Touring Car Challenge. (HTCC)

This popular series for Historic Touring Cars will be extending the entry regulations to include Group A cars right up to December 1990 – to cover normally-aspirated cars; and smaller capacity turbo-charged cars. The Historic Touring Car Challenge, entering its sixth season in 2016, has traditionally filled grids with cars from the British and European Touring Car Championships from 1966 right up to 1985. The Group 1, Group 2 and Group A eras include a mixture of Ford Capri, Triumph Dolomite Sprints, TWR XJS and Rover Vitesses. But the grid extension will now also open the doors for newcomers such as BMW M3, Toyota Corolla and Astra GTEs, all of which will now be eligible to compete.

This year the Historic Touring Car Challenge season opens at the prestigious Donington Historic Festival (April 30-May 2) before making its debut stand-alone appearance at Silverstone Classic (July 29-31) followed by a visit to Spa during the Six Hour Endurance weekend (Sept 16 -18). Rounding off the year with a weekend in Portimao for the Algarve Classic Festival. (Oct 28-30)"

Well the inclusion of M3s has quite possibly given all the Group A Rover owners a reason to go to the Peter Auto Series.

Originally Posted by Mike Bell

And the Gp1 Trophy info-

"To be named the ‘Tony Dron Trophy’ - in honour of the ‘70s Touring Car ace and Le Mans sports car driver Tony Dron – the new series is for Touring Cars running to FIA Group 1 regulations or to British Saloon Car Championship ‘Group 1½’ regulations between 1970 and 1982. Tony, a familiar face around historic race paddocks, remains a highly respected driver to this day and regular writer in the historic motorsport press.

The overall winner of the Tony Dron Trophy each year will be awarded the actual trophy presented to Tony for winning the Tricentrol British Saloon Car Championship support race at the British Grand Prix in 1977 – the year that Dron missed out on the Championship by a single point. The Tony Dron Trophy will run within Motor Racing Legends’ Historic Touring Car Challenge grid, with its own podium and results for each race. "

This is good news for those of us with Group 11/2 cars. Hopefully there will be more on the grid.

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Well the inclusion of M3s has quite possibly given all the Group A Rover owners a reason to go to the Peter Auto Series.

I certainly hope not!!!

The earlier Group A cars such as the Jag XJS and Rover, true British racing makes, need to be able to run in a suitable series in Britain against their period rivals, and not have to look overseas because organisers have decided to go for an 'easy option' in looking for more recent cars of which there are naturally many more in number.

The emphasis should remain on encouraging the owns of the original cars and selected true recreations to come out and play imo.

There are enough M3's and Sierras to race in a series of their own.

However as our Antipodean friends will rightly point out the older and newer cars run very well together over there so why shouldn't they do the same over here.

6 of 1 and half a dozen of the other really isn't it?

Maybe it is time for a few people who have the non homolgation special cars close to their hearts to get together and set up a proper series covering the UK and one or two overseas rounds where there are also a number of suitable cars with hardly anywhere to race them other than the Peter Auto series.

I think a series covering the late model Grp 1.5 cars through to the end of 1986 (which would then allow the Holden and Merkur) with some suitable promotion and 'pushing' in the right areas would bring dividends.

There are sufficient Rovers, BMW's, Volvo's the XJS, Capris, alfetta's at least 2 Metro Turbos and various smaller cars coming along to think about it?

[Duddha]

And an interesting problem regarding the M3 is not only that it will kill all other competition but also that it will probably be the hardest possible car to police in terms of specification as the Homologation form is more like a book, the Escort one looking very small compared to it and also the fact that this model was very different if ran in DTM or ETCC spec as an example..!

Why all series were before using that 1984 homologation cut off date but 86' spec accepted was that an 86' spec Rover or Volvo could be better with Group 2s, after that, history speaking, in Group A the Ford started coming in and then the M3s... It was the 2nd gen of Group A in period and obviously if so called in period, there was and still is a point on the spec and cars both in terms of technology, drivetrains and also electronics.

Making up number is always good but I just fear it will benefit the high end Peter Auto series and the English one will become the S14 club.

PS - In Germany, the series allowing such cars is essentially composed of real or replica E30 based M3s..

[Mike Bell]

The regulations for 2016 HTCC and the new Gp1 'Tony Don Trophy' have been released. According to the latter regs, cars must use Dunlop CR65 tyres, which for a 1981 Gp1 car sounds all wrong......

I'm emailing MRL for clarification!

[Peter Mallett]

That's what we use at Goodwood. Don't know if there's enough of them though.

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

That's what we use at Goodwood. Don't know if there's enough of them though.

Mine last year were CR82 Post Historic, not CR65. The latter denotes Ls or Ms...... No doubt there won't be enough of whatever!

[Peter Mallett]

Ah I stand corrected. Never know what these Dunlops are.

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Ah I stand corrected. Never know what these Dunlops are.

I try not to know which is which! All gets very confusing.... Anyway, I've asked MRL the question, as my car has Avon slicks fitted at the moment.

[Peter Mallett]

I'm told it's because they want to encourage as many Goodwood cars as possible. I can't run slicks because they don't make them. I'd have to run Yokohamas.

Anyway I've entered for Donington, Silverstone and Spa. Rain checking Portugal at the moment.

[Mike Bell]

Excellent. Not sure how well Algarve will go this year, as October has 5 big Euro meetings in 5 weeks. I should be at Imola w/end before (as will Peter Auto Touring cars) so am unlikely to make Portugal. Shame, I'll miss all the queuing at the gate and battles to get in the place!

Sounds like others have trouble differentiating between tyre types as well.......

Edit- I've just found the tyre answer looking at the 74MM entry form- it says tyres must be 'Post Historic with CR65 tread pattern'. Not the same as CR65, so hopefully MRL will adjust their wording!

[Mike Bell]

Just to muddy the waters more, the set of 'CR82 Post Historic' Dunlop tyres I have are marked in very small letters- 'CR65 Mk lll' I'm guessing that Mk 1 was 'L', Mk ll was 'M'....

The clue to a tyre being Post Historic appears to be the sizing- more modern terminology used, such as 175/550-13....

[Peter Mallett]

Yes mine say CR65 too.

[Mike Bell]

I'm guessing the tyre moulds are original and tyres were 'CR65 Mk lll' back in the day!

Result is that hopefully anyone else beside me that was confused now know which tyres are being referred to in the regs..... Same as Goodwood Gerry Marshall Trophy!