Blue Book safety regs

[graeme]

Don't suppose the Blue Book safety regs (section Q?) are on-line anywhere?

[Teletubby]

Dunno Graeme, what are you looking for, I'm at home with a copy of the Blue Book.

[graeme]

It's the whole section, to send to a chap in France who wants to race in the UK. French regs seem a lot laxer than those here...

[Dave Brand]

Originally Posted by graeme

Don't suppose the Blue Book safety regs (section Q?) are on-line anywhere?

Log in to the MSA website & click on 'Member Publications'.

[graeme]

Logged in -after several attempts - but where's "Member Publications"? Tis a rubbish website...

[Al Weyman]

And why are they so coy on letting non members see it, never understood that.

[Dave Brand]

Originally Posted by graeme

Logged in -after several attempts - but where's "Member Publications"?

Third item down in the menu on the left hand side.....unless logging in as a driver takes you to a different page than logging in as a marshal does.

[greenamex2]

Originally Posted by graeme

It's the whole section, to send to a chap in France who wants to race in the UK. French regs seem a lot laxer than those here...

Quote from Al Murray, pub landlord -

Where would we be if we didn't have rules.

France.

[cannardd]

http://www.msauk.org/uploadedfiles/m...ook_2006_Q.pdf

You will probably need to be logged in to get to it, but you will be able to save the pdf file and email to your friend in France.

[graeme]

Thanks chaps! I was telling the French guys that they would need fireproof bulkhead front and rear but, when I look through section Q, I can't find any mention of them - I guess I'm just thinking of series regs which demand them??

Do you reckon the old "A" shaped driver-only roll hoops are still legal in the UK - http://artweb.gr.jp/mc/71photo2.gif

[Dan Friel]

Graeme,

Martin Stewart and John Schneider both run those bars on caterhams in the 750MC series.

[JimW]

Originally Posted by cannardd

http://www.msauk.org/uploadedfiles/m...ook_2006_Q.pdf

You will probably need to be logged in to get to it, but you will be able to save the pdf file and email to your friend in France.

No, this is the MSA. They make users go to the inconvenience of having to login (and hence be License holders or registered marshals) but they are too incompetent to secure the eventual file when you know the URL like this link.

Regards

Jim

[midgetman]

But what kind of organisation is it that chucks you out if you don't follow the rules, but won't let you see the rules before you join? I have never, ever understood why the BB is not distributed FOC to anyone who asks - another barrier to getting in to the sport!

[Dan Friel]

There's certainly no reason why it shouldn't be available to all from the website... what can the justification for hiding it away be??

[cannardd]

Non licence holders can purchase a copy of the blue book if they wish.

[Al Weyman]

I don't see why they should give it away free as it is quite a publication and printing aint cheap but I think it should be free access on the net because some projects can span several years so it would be nice to be able to update without having to buy a new book every year before you are ready to participate. I also think it would help get more people interested.

[JohnD]

graeme,
Are your French fiends aware of the hurdles that the MSA as enforcers for the FIA put in front of anyone wanting to compete in another country?
Apart from anything else only events 'inscribed' on the FIA "National Events with Authorised Foreign Participation Calendar" are enterable. See E 6.1, E 2.21.6 and p.269 of the Blue Book. We need 'A' Race licences or above to go abroad - don't know about the French coming here.

John

[graeme]

John - no, they aren't aware of the hurdles - I'm trying to find them for them! Any advice greatfuly recieved. They are a great bunch of chaps, who really want to race in the UK, and I don't want them to turn up and not be able to race. The "Nation Events..." thing jogged my memory - it does have to be a listed event, don't it? (how come I managed to race at Charade a couple of weeks ago? - was it listed? - or are they just a bit more lax on the continent? - I reckon I could have got away with a Nat B licence for all they checked it! - rather than £150+ to upgrade to an International). I'm looking at a race at next year's Caterham Festival, which should be listed... (but will check now). Continental International licences are given out like toilet paper (papier hygenic) I believe - I don't think you need race finishes to gain one (I entered a competition last year to race in the Ring 24 Hours and there were loads of novices - I asked the organisers how they could get an International licence and was told they just pay more for them!).

[Eddy V]

The French will probably need an International C licence to race abroad, unless it is their own championship, that is the way it is usually done over here (Belgium, Germany, Holland).
But with the French you never know.

[JohnD]

graeme,
I'm sure Eddy knows more about the Continental aspects than I do. I got interested when an American e-friend, coming to the UK for a holiday, asked about the same thing. He races in the US equivalent series to ours, and there was even a rent-a-race arangement in the UK that he could use.
I asked the MSA what papers he needed or what he should do, and straight faced, they said:
Surrender his US licence
Take an ARDS course
Apply for a UK licence,
and would not budge!

Eventually, I spoke to someone on the MSA Executive, who said that they were being driven by FIA regs that changed frequently, and that they could do nothing else to help my friend.

My own series has been asked and wants to admit people from France and Germany who fancy a foreign foray (Enough with the alliteration. Ed.). There was a move to have some races (it's races not series) so 'inscribed' and to invite them over, but we have other problems (falling numbers) and I know not how far the process has got. Certainly - see Section V of the Blue Book - we only need an 'A' to go to Europe, not an International licence.

I'd go straight to the MSA, but be prepared for a beurocratic response, and suggest to your friends that they do the same for their motrosport authority. There's always an organised track day, but it's not the same,is it?

Good luck!
If you find that things have changed - and I will not be surprised - please report back.

John

[Anuauto]

That's really going to encourage new blood isn't it? - asking people to pay to see regs before they know whether they want to compete. Fortunately the FIA are not so narrow minded and their regs can be accessed by all (even what they were years ago in the case of Appendix J). How many Blur Books do they think they sell by hiding GRs on line?
It's been raised on other forums. So, all who don't like it, tell the MSC (not the paid help, the MSA, who assume far too much decision-making in the absence of a proprerly elected MSC). It takes a brief Email.

Regarding licencing and foreign participation, it's not unrelated to the war between the FIA and the EU that sent the former running to Switzerland to hide from the latter. Logic is: EU contries can all cross-compete as much as they like at all levels if they are prepared to have one EU seat at FIA, not one for every EU country.

[midgetman]

Oh yeah you can buy the book. But are we trying to entice people into the sport or what?

OK, OK, the cost isn't great but it's a barrier. As Dan says, no reason at all not to have it on the web. Could save a bit on the licence fee if they didn't print any BBs.

[Dan Friel]

Graeme, with regards to the french coming to the caterham festival, I'm sure you're aware but plenty of them came over a few years back (about 2002 / 2003?). Who arranged it then?? May just be able to repeat the process of going through the loops??

[carrera]

Gerard Faber and his team have been popping over from Paris for the last couple of seasons to compete in Classic Thunder. He must have been through the process of application for a permit to race in England from his own ASN or the MSA.