McLaren have a further four-week wait/McLaren apology

[shaunx]

The WMSC were due to rule on whether McLaren’s 2008 challenger – the MP4-23 - had any Ferrari intellectual property on it today, however the WMSC have decided that Ferrari and McLaren should have some input into the report and therefore they have postponed making a decision on the issue for a further four weeks.

[Knowlesy]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/64335

Please post links to any stories you post to substantiate them. Thanks.

I wonder what the good reason is. Or is it possible to read too much into this?

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by Knowlesy

I wonder what the good reason is. Or is it possible to read too much into this?

i can see the logic of going through the proper steps to properly clear Mclaren simply that this whole thing can be put in the pass.

but at this late stage is it even possible to say that if something is found that it came from "spygate" or through more traditional and acceptable forms of espionage like analyzing photos of the Ferrari and engineers first hand knowledge of what they have seen in the pits etc.?

[Ralf's Girl]

Originally Posted by chillibowl

but at this late stage is it even possible to say that if something is found that it came from "spygate" or through more traditional and acceptable forms of espionage like analyzing photos of the Ferrari and engineers first hand knowledge of what they have seen in the pits etc.?

I don't think it's possible to distinguish between the two (unless, obviously, there was something on the car that was identical to Ferrari down to minute details), but whether that will stop the FIA trying to hang McLaren out to dry is another matter.

[Marbot]

Originally Posted by chillibowl

i can see the logic of going through the proper steps to properly clear Mclaren simply that this whole thing can be put in the pass.

but at this late stage is it even possible to say that if something is found that it came from "spygate" or through more traditional and acceptable forms of espionage like analyzing photos of the Ferrari and engineers first hand knowledge of what they have seen in the pits etc.?

I feel that the FIA have given McLaren a while to 'put things in order' as it were.It could be something that is not visible from the outside,in which case McLaren would indeed have a bit of explaining to do.

[sizzle]

Originally Posted by martyn bott

I feel that the FIA have given McLaren a while to 'put things in order' as it were.It could be something that is not visible from the outside,in which case McLaren would indeed have a bit of explaining to do.

Why would you have anything on your car that was hidden or otherwise that was not available to all if you knew your car was going to be gone over with a fine tooth comb?

I feel it has more to do with the last paragraph than anything else!

I do not have a problem with Ron," he said. "I only want to hear the truth if we have to solve an internal problem. During the World Council meeting on July 26, I did not have the impression that he told us the truth."

And he reckons it is not a witch hunt

[Teretonga]

Max told us the WMSC was about the facts.... Now he tells us it was a feeling or intuition that is guiding his assessment of Ron.....

Make up your mind Max. The more you spin a spiders web, the more likely you are to be caught up in your own words...(sorry...) web....

[Gt_R]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/64369
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/64370

Now... who was caught in their own "web ..."?

Not meaning to rub salt in wound, but while FIA is constantly blamed for taking action, these investigations do turn up quite a few "skeletons" that otherwise won't be made known.

If the reports are true, there will be quite a few red faces around, and not just in the Mclaren camp.

[chillibowl]

im probably still in the camp of willing to forgive but not forget Mclarens involvment, but this apology does alot for me in putting these events in the past.
they stepped up and accepted that they could have dealt with this better. i know some might say its all a little too late, but this is by far more than what was required of them and more than what i expected from them.

so classy move i think.

[enemy-ace]

classy move or damage control. I am afraid it seems more the latter.

[Knowlesy]

I don't think they even needed to do it. There is nothing to apologise for.

[brands]

http://www.fia.com/mediacentre/Press...131207-01.html

[Gt_R]

I believe, and i may be wrong, that this statement of apology comes in response of "new" information that emerge from the new report, which FIA has made known to Mclaren their concerns.

I disagree that there is nothing to apologize for. FIA has got much criticism (though understandable) for their investigation of Mclaren, with many accusing it purely as a "witch-hunt". However, that the investigations continually reveal more truths and information showed that while FIA is harsh, their actions were not unneccessary. Without FIA's unpopular insistence to monitor and interfer, we would not have known about the emails, and now, that more within the team in Mclaren knew.

If Mclaren has taken this stance from early on, much of this embarrassment could have been avoided. Rather than let FIA dig out things little by little... It's not nice a situation, regardless of whose fans we are.

It's unfortunate that this case seem to drag on forever. I had hoped for closure after the punishment being issued, but every few weeks, we have new developments that reveal more about the unfortunate case.

I'm sure many can forgive, even if they can't forget. All teams do wrong, at some point in history.

Dragging it on will not do us, FIA and Mclaren any good.

Next thing we know, maybe the Mclaren statement is a prank from some FIA-sponsored hacker?

[Marbot]

Originally Posted by Knowlesy

I don't think they even needed to do it. There is nothing to apologise for.

Like I said in an earlier post,it was the FIA's intention to always give McLaren time to 'put things in order'.

[Adam43]

Originally Posted by Knowlesy

I don't think they even needed to do it. There is nothing to apologise for.

I await Stepney's letter to the FIA.

[Teretonga]

After reading the FIA investigation and the specific evidence the FIA has on what was used and not used, I am amazed that this is all Ferrari were complaining about.

I cannot see that it justifies the fine nor does it make sense in the light of Renault getting off....
The whole thing is ridiculous so the disparity between the two hearing s makes Brundles comments even more relevant.

[Marbot]

Originally Posted by Teretonga

I am amazed that this is all Ferrari were complaining about.

The amount is not important,but the fact that McLaren admit to using it,is.

Originally Posted by Teretonga

I cannot see that it justifies the fine nor does it make sense in the light of Renault getting off....
The whole thing is ridiculous so the disparity between the two hearing s makes Brundles comments even more relevant.

Renault are not "getting off",just you wait and see.

The whole thing is ridiculous,but you can't point the finger solely at the FIA for that!

[Teretonga]

I understand your point Martin but...

I still think the apology is because the FIA have extracted it by manipulation...
"The car is wrong....apologise or we'll penalise you further..."

[Gt_R]

You mean like how Fernando was made to say Mclaren's a great team before he could walk out on his contract?

I'm glad that Mclaren has apologized, thereby putting much things into perspective. Ron's a man who believes in his principles, and i doubt he will let Mclaren apologize if he think the team's innocent. And appropriately, Max has asked for closure too.

[Teretonga]

I meant the 2008 car.... which now is OK.... because Ron apologised?
If it was OK now it was OK before. McLaren would have given the FIA those assurances so why was it delayed till February....

I am sorry but I don't regard operating like that as acceptable behaviour.

[Knowlesy]

Originally Posted by Gt_R

And appropriately, Max has asked for closure too.

How nice of him. I applaud him for breaking this off, prematurely some may argue.

The point of the apology is beyond me. To revert to "broken-record-and-slightly-off-topic-I-suppose" mode for a second, there are only two people that should be doing any apologising. Prat #1 Stepney and prat #2 Coughlan.

On my planet, which I admit is quite far removed from reality at times, Stepney would be hauled over the coals for nicking data and then Ferrari told "well, sorry and all that, but you should have better document control". (I note the Stepney side of things has gone eerily silent of late, by which I mean about three months). Coughlan would be burned at the stake as well. Everyone else with a minor involvement would be slapped on the wrists a bit, but just one of those things I'm afraid.

So excuse me if I find all this apology nonsense quite hilarious, but I just can't help myself.

[andy_b]

Originally Posted by Teretonga

I am sorry but I don't regard operating like that as acceptable behaviour.

Your new to F1 arent you

the releasing of various statements today is so obviously staged managed.

at least we have closure for now....until the next spy scandal....and mark my words, there will be one

[Ralf's Girl]

Originally Posted by Knowlesy

The point of the apology is beyond me. To revert to "broken-record-and-slightly-off-topic-I-suppose" mode for a second, there are only two people that should be doing any apologising. Prat #1 Stepney and prat #2 Coughlan.

On my planet, which I admit is quite far removed from reality at times, Stepney would be hauled over the coals for nicking data and then Ferrari told "well, sorry and all that, but you should have better document control". (I note the Stepney side of things has gone eerily silent of late, by which I mean about three months). Coughlan would be burned at the stake as well. Everyone else with a minor involvement would be slapped on the wrists a bit, but just one of those things I'm afraid.

[ralf fan]

This apology seems as genuine as the Max-Ron handshake days after the punishment was dished out.

[Teretonga]

andy b:

Your new to F1 arent you

I guess so...if you call 1960-2007 new to the sport....

My comment has more to do with what should be appropriate civilised behaviour rather than what is accepted as 'normal' behaviour amongst those involved in the political machinations we have at present.

It is not purely objective but more subjective, my opinion about what behaviour should be like, rather than what people actually do do to each other.