2005

[TomS]

Autosport this week says about a small confirmed grid for IRL next year. Ok, there is a huge amount of talent but surely the numbers are just as if not more important. Has IRL made the mistake of chasing out all the smaller teams as Penske etc joined?

[GP Racer]

Thats a great question Tom.

At first, it all seemed so good. I mean, having all the big name teams in your series seemed to be a dream come true. Its what every series wants to have. It looked as though the IRL was taking the next step, and going big time.

But now, I'm not so sure. I feel as though this series is beginning to look to much like CART, and going down the same road that put them out of business. These teams, along with the manufacturers, have to much influence over which direction the IRL will take. I'm quite sure it was them that pushed for road and street racing, and it was them that have, and still are, bringing in to many foreign drivers. They seem to have to much self interest, and are not concerned for what or who the fans want to see, or what is best for the series to grow.

Right now, I have mixed feelings about the direction this series is going. Will the big guys stick around without manufacturer money? Will it become completely unaffordable to the little guys? Do they care about the success or failure of this series, or are they just milking it dry? IMHO, these are the important questions, that will probably be answered in the next two seasons, which are key...

[Kicking-back]

I think we'll end up with a 20-22 car field again, which in the current climate is decent.

[climb]

Hope KB's right.

[N I Tram]

It's a shame that 22-car field wuld be made up of less different teams than before though - I'm certainyl sad that so many teams have disappearerd in recent seasons.

[BootsOntheSide]

I'm not convinced that any of the US drivers lost from the 2004 grid were any better than some of the guys who've replaced them - the only real losses in terms of calibre and popularity were Al Jr, Gil and Kenny - and at least we did gain Buddy and Alex Barron as full-timers, not to mention Townsend finally getting a good go at something. Unfortunately, the changes for 2005 could be a different story - Adrian may be gone, Townsend as well, not to mention great teams like Mo Nunn and Kelley, both of whom proved themselves in 2003 and before. A third Ganassi car for someone who has to prove himself on ovals would be poor recompense.

[FIRE]

Is IRL getting hard competition from GrandAm? (Maybe a stupid question but I don't follow IRL and GrandAm closely)

[mabs_nsx]

Is Ryan Briscoe going to be in IRL next year because I have heird that he is?????

It would be good to see an Aussie in IRL

[Sparky05]

Originally Posted by FIRE

Is IRL getting hard competition from GrandAm? (Maybe a stupid question but I don't follow IRL and GrandAm closely)

I don't believe so. The teams that are filling GA's roster have been sportscar teams or new teams to motorsport in general. Although I remember reading somewhere, sometime, that PTG considered an IRL team at one point.

Originally Posted by mabs_nsx

Is Ryan Briscoe going to be in IRL next year because I have heird that he is?????

It would be good to see an Aussie in IRL

He very well could be. Briscoe tested for Ganassi and Ganassi is rumored to be bringing in a third team.

[rustyfan]

I think the IRL needs to take notice of how things are run in NASCAR - if the teams in the IRL were able to build the cars and engines themselves, I'm quite positive costs would come down, which in turn would make it more attractive to try your luck as a team-owner.

Not to mention the bigger teams could build engines for the smaller teams (which definitely would be cheaper), again like the big dogs in NASCAR do (Hendrick, Yates, Roush etc).

I mean, just take a look at NASCAR and you'll see that it works - new teams come in to try their luck every year, some even without a primary sponsor (and despite that do their damnest to run the entire 36-race season). Often this is made possible because of deals with bigger teams that provide engines, sometimes at a discounted price in return for race data from the other team (which for obvious reasons is a great deal for a new team).

Then again, with Honda and Toyota 'in control' I'm afraid the above is probably just a distant dream - I doubt such discussions even came up during the recent summit.

[Hazza]

How would NASCAR engines go in IRL cars? Then you'd get Ford/Chevy/Merc or what ever rompin along with home made engines, it'd be like the old days realy...

[GP Racer]

Good points rustyfan and Hazza.

I'm sure your correct when you said that at the recent engine summit, you doubt a different engine approach was even brought up. We must be missing something, because most all of us here are in agreement that a different approach to the engine problem needs to be taken. Why doesn't the IRL see it? Are they so beholden to Honda and Toyota, that they are afraid to try something different? Why won't the IRL do something to avoid becoming CART II, which I'm afraid is fast occuring.

I'm afraid the IRL will be left in some lurch should Toyota and Honda pull out. The small teams are already gone, and unlikely to return, and what would the big teams do without the manufacturer money? Let's hope they have an alternative, that doesn't include Honda or Toyota, should this happen...

[Testure]

Originally Posted by rustyfan

... if the teams in the IRL were able to build the cars and engines themselves, I'm quite positive costs would come down ...

Could you elaborate on that one, rustyfan? Seems to me that the opposite would occur. At the moment, the aero and engine changes that can be made are extremely tightly controlled by the IRL. If that was loosened up, teams like Penske and Ganassi could easily spend their way to race wins. Building open-wheel racing machines can suck up an unimaginable amount of cash. Just ask Paul Stoddart!

[mac]

Briscoe will be confirmed within seven days.

Mo Nunn certainly liked the look of him. After seeing him test, he hinted that if he could get a talent like that he could be persuaded to stick around.

Boots, you don't need to worry about Briscoe. He will be just fine.

[Hazza]

Okay the idea is that you have more options
At the moment it is a price-fixed market, with the companies offered no competittion. But if Penske said to me I can get my boys to knock up a couple of Ford V8s for 500,000 a season, or you can grab a factory 'Yota for 1,000,000, what would you do?

Is it a coincidence that series' with a dyi mentallity are going stronger than customer style series?

Look at the V8supercar series in aus, there are 3 ways to do it. 1: Grab an engine from a factory team, grab an engine from a customer team, or do it yourself.

btw: The way it is now the companies are the ones that are spending their way to victory. Name the number of times that a team has done marvously things working independantly in the company's name...

[rustyfan]

Originally Posted by Testure

Could you elaborate on that one, rustyfan? Seems to me that the opposite would occur. At the moment, the aero and engine changes that can be made are extremely tightly controlled by the IRL. If that was loosened up, teams like Penske and Ganassi could easily spend their way to race wins. Building open-wheel racing machines can suck up an unimaginable amount of cash. Just ask Paul Stoddart!

The engine design is very strict in NASCAR as well. I wasn't saying the IRL teams should be allowed to freely develop the engines any way they can (they aren't allowed that in NASCAR either) - what I meant was that the teams should be allowed to build their own Toyota/Honda/Chevrolet engines from a set design, and not be forced to lease them from each respective manufacturer. I'm positive, yes, that it would cut costs, especially for the smaller teams if they could buy their engines from bigger teams who build their own engines. It is, after all, the smaller teams that is the issue here - the big boys will spend a lot of money anyway, regardless of how the rules look or what the options are. It's always has been that way, and it'll always be that way.

If the costs for getting started, or running a smaller outfit, in the championship are too high, it won't attract smaller teams nor people being prepared to take risks in order to try their luck, which at some point might even kill a series. And this, I'm afraid, is exactly what's happening to the IRL IndyCar Series right now.

[GP Racer]

To add to what's been said, the lease program from the manufacturers is very expensive, basically because they do all of the building and maintaining of engines. The teams already are employing and paying fully qualified mechanics, that right now, are being underutilised, because they don't build or rebuild the engines. I say, let the teams pick any engine, and build and maintain them themselves, as long as it could be brought into the IRL spec.

The problem I see for the IRL, is that all of the big teams are being paid big bucks by the manufacturers to run their engines. When the mob does this, they call it extortion, when manufacturers do it, they call it, "support money". What would these teams do if the manufacturers leave, and that money went away? Leave possibly. And there are no small teams left to pick-up the slack if they do.

Right now, the manufacturers have to much control over this series, and it's going to be tough to get out from under them...

[Timu]

I'd expect better things from Toyota and Scotty Dixon this year, and I hope that stunning looking chick called Danica does well too! She is a real rose among the thorns out there!

[mac]

Well judging from the test times, it appears Toyota still have a fair bit of catching up to do.

[trow]

Since it's ok to speculate, I feel the IRL will be good for owners and drivers alike if they can meet in the middle somewhere on the exact Formula which holds the interests of AGR, Penske, Toyota, Honda, and attracts lower budgeted teams. It's good to have a road course oval mix but it must suit the majority fanbase whether thats ovals or roads.

We'll see what comes out of it, but I'm confident the IRL is going to make the changes necessary to create a fantastic series.