BTCC Round Six, Knockhill 30-31 Jul, Races 16,17&18

crmalcolm · 5 Jul 2022, 13:58 (Ref:4118324)

Next up on the BTCC calendar for 2022 is the two-day tyre test at Snetterton on 12th and 13th July.
After that, the paddock heads north of the border to Knockhill for the only (current) meeting outside of England. This is another circuit that is traditionally seen as a RWD-favouring track, so the FWD runners will again be hoping to disprove this theory as they did last time out at Croft. Ingram will go into the meeting as championship leader, whilst Cook will be hoping to see his recent performance issues resolved. Turkington will be hoping that he can get his title challenge back on track, while Sutton will be looking to bounce back from his first DNF of the season.

Both Parfitt and Butel are set to return to the grid after missing the last meeting, with the grid back up to 29 cars.

Cook is now on 21 straight points-scoring races, with local hero Butcher on a run of 14 consecutive races in the points. What chance an all-Scottish podium during the weekend? The crowd will be hoping to hear Flower of Scotland played at the circuit – and we are fairly certain to hear Ting-A-Ling-A-Loo at some point!

The first BTCC meeting at Knockhill was held in 1992, making this a fairly recent addition to the calendar as the series branched out of England to include races in Scotland and Wales. The 1992 meeting was a memorable one, with heavy rain dominating proceedings. A future WRC champion by the name of Colin McRae made a guest appearance that day for BMW – although his performance was not without incident. After finishing a credible eighth in the first race, he was disqualified from race two for a dangerous manoeuvre overtaking Matt Neal.
Alain Menu also had a weekend to forget – he broke his leg in an accident involving a paddock quad bike after qualifying and took no further part in the rest of the season.
John Cleland also found himself disqualified from a race that day, for ignoring a black flag in race one. The podium for race one saw Jeff Allam take the top step, ahead of Tim Harvey and Andy Rouse. Race two saw Tim Harvey take the win ahead of Allam and Cleland.

A relatively short circuit, many drivers describe the track as being like no other on the calendar. High kerbs make for a common photo opportunity of seeing a car up high on two wheels, and the undulations make cars very unstable. A current driver has previously claimed that you do not drive Knockhill in the traditional way. Instead of slow in, fast out – they said you try and carry as much speed as possible through the corner and hold on tight!!

NGTC machinery may not seem ideally suited to this circuit, with the 2012 race wins going to S2000 machinery – Collard taking a pair of wins. Turkington repeated this feat in 2013, indicating that the circuit seems to favour RWD. In 2020, RWD machinery again took the first two race wins, Sutton claiming both before home favourite Rory Butcher took the race three win.

2021 continued the trend of RWD success, with Turkington taking R1 and Sutton in R2. BTC Racing’s Honda also looked good though, with a podium double in race one. Race two saw a RWD 1-2, with Hill getting the third podium place behind Turkington. Race three saw one of the moves of the season by Ingram to get ahead of Jelley out of the hairpin and take the win. Proctor finished second ahead of Jelley – making the podium score for the weekend 5-4 in favour of FWD.

Qualifying will be on the ITV Hub at www.itv.com/btcc, with the Sunday coverage on ITV4.

A weather forecast this far ahead for Scotland is likely to change, but currently it shows that Saturday and Sunday are both predicted to be 17deg temperatures with a 75% chance of rain.

redshoes · 6 Jul 2022, 16:17 (Ref:4118458)

https://www.btcc.net/2022/07/06/itv-...erage-in-2022/

More ITV/ITV4 DVR shuffle for Knockhill

porsche962fan · 6 Jul 2022, 17:39 (Ref:4118465)

you could just skip race 1 as nothing really happen in those

Evantra · 6 Jul 2022, 17:53 (Ref:4118469)

Quote:

Originally Posted by porsche962fan

you could just skip race 1 as nothing really happen in those

Think BTCC needs to hire you to do their PR!

crmalcolm · 6 Jul 2022, 18:49 (Ref:4118476)

Quote:

Originally Posted by porsche962fan

you could just skip race 1 as nothing really happen in those

Or just skip it altogether and not bother watching at all......

porsche962fan · 6 Jul 2022, 19:01 (Ref:4118477)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evantra

Think BTCC needs to hire you to do their PR!

isn't someone else doing all the defending of every aspect of the series ?

BTCC frog · 6 Jul 2022, 19:56 (Ref:4118480)

Maths-based predictions for most points scored in Knockhill, using the same model as the Thruxton ones:

1. Tom Ingram
2. Jake Hill
3. Colin Turkington
4. Gordon Shedden
5. Stephen Jelley
6. Josh Cook
7. Dan Cammish
8. Aiden Moffat
9. Ash Sutton
10. Tom Chilton
11. Rory Butcher
12. Jason Plato
13. Dan Lloyd
14. Dan Rowbottom
15. Ricky Collard
16. Adam Morgan
17. Bobby Thompson
18. Aron Taylor-Smith
19. George Gamble
20. Dexter Patterson
21. Ash Hand
22. Jack Butel
23. Michael Crees
24. Jade Edwards
25. Ollie Jackson
26. Sam Osborne
27. Rick Parfitt
28. Will Powell
29. Nic Hamilton

crmalcolm · 6 Jul 2022, 19:58 (Ref:4118482)

Some great (and expected) responses from the knowledgeable BTCC 'fans' - https://www.facebook.com/16567075014...x7Qa5bhV8hbdl/

pimmy · 7 Jul 2022, 16:23 (Ref:4118566)

Yay, another afternoon of hearing the commentators explain what a car is to the ITV1-viewing plebeians.

3marinadrive · 22 Jul 2022, 08:25 (Ref:4120107)

Just before we start the second half of the season, we've had great discussion with some fellow BTCC fans/mates - gotta love a good old debate!

Based on performances in qualifying, race craft, overall pace, race results etc...we broke down the regular grid (excluding changes for Butel, Parfitt etc) and split the grid into three groups;

Elite - Quality - The Rest (couldn't think of any better titles!)

So the following list comes after much debate - and to be clear is just opinion of three old blokes who love BTCC, so here you go:

Each list is alphabetical by the way;

Elite 10 Drivers;

Butcher
Cammish
Cook
Hill
Ingram
Lloyd
Morgan
Sutton
Shedden
Turkington

Quality 10 drivers;

Chilton
Collard
Gamble
Jelley
Hand
Moffat
Patterson
Plato
Rowbottom
Thompson

The Rest - 9 Drivers

Butel
Crees
Edwards
Jackson
Hamilton
Osborne
Parfitt
Powell
Taylor-Smith

Lots of debate around the Elite group re Morgan, Rowbottom, Jelley, Plato, Moffat, Gamble...any of those could be in for sure....

Likewise Jackson, Edwards, Taylor-Smith moving into the 'Quality; group - everyone has their favourites and of course has an opinion ...this is ours, be interested to see everyone's thoughts and see their lists

Interesting final fact;

At the end of 2021 the top 7 Drivers were Sutton, Turkington, Cook, Ingram, Hill, Shedden and Butcher

At the half way point in 2022 the top 7 are....Ingram, Cook, Turkington, Sutton, Shedden, Butcher

Cream will rise I guess...!

3marinadrive · 22 Jul 2022, 08:26 (Ref:4120108)

Quote:

Originally Posted by 3marinadrive

Just before we start the second half of the season, we've had great discussion with some fellow BTCC fans/mates - gotta love a good old debate!

Based on performances in qualifying, race craft, overall pace, race results etc...we broke down the regular grid (excluding changes for Butel, Parfitt etc) and split the grid into three groups;

Elite - Quality - The Rest (couldn't think of any better titles!)

So the following list comes after much debate - and to be clear is just opinion of three old blokes who love BTCC, so here you go:

Each list is alphabetical by the way;

Elite 10 Drivers;

Butcher
Cammish
Cook
Hill
Ingram
Lloyd
Morgan
Sutton
Shedden
Turkington

Quality 10 drivers;

Chilton
Collard
Gamble
Jelley
Hand
Moffat
Patterson
Plato
Rowbottom
Thompson

The Rest - 9 Drivers

Butel
Crees
Edwards
Jackson
Hamilton
Osborne
Parfitt
Powell
Taylor-Smith

Lots of debate around the Elite group re Morgan, Rowbottom, Jelley, Plato, Moffat, Gamble...any of those could be in for sure....

Likewise Jackson, Edwards, Taylor-Smith moving into the 'Quality; group - everyone has their favourites and of course has an opinion ...this is ours, be interested to see everyone's thoughts and see their lists

Interesting final fact;

At the end of 2021 the top 7 Drivers were Sutton, Turkington, Cook, Ingram, Hill, Shedden and Butcher

At the half way point in 2022 the top 7 are....Ingram, Cook, Turkington, Sutton, Shedden, Butcher

Cream will rise I guess...!

And Hill of course!

Evantra · 22 Jul 2022, 08:37 (Ref:4120109)

I'm interested in the placement of Patterson! I would personally move Lloyd down but otherwise agree.

A shame that Taylor-Smith (and maybe Jackson after his double-winning season) are now struggling so much.

crmalcolm · 22 Jul 2022, 08:48 (Ref:4120111)

TV Coverage details for Sunday:

2:00pm-3:00pm - ITV (races 16 and 17)
2:55pm-6:00pm - ITV4 (race 18)

S griffin · 22 Jul 2022, 09:06 (Ref:4120114)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evantra

I'm interested in the placement of Patterson! I would personally move Lloyd down but otherwise agree.

A shame that Taylor-Smith (and maybe Jackson after his double-winning season) are now struggling so much.

Jackson and ATS are both good enough, it's just it's not working out for them atm. Put them in better cars and they can still do the job

Mike Harte · 22 Jul 2022, 09:25 (Ref:4120118)

Quote:

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

TV Coverage details for Sunday:

2:00pm-3:00pm - ITV (races 16 and 17)
2:55pm-6:00pm - ITV4 (race 18)

I think a mistype there; coverage starts on ITV from 12:00 according to the BTCC website.

Evantra · 22 Jul 2022, 09:39 (Ref:4120120)

Quote:

Originally Posted by S griffin

Jackson and ATS are both good enough, it's just it's not working out for them atm. Put them in better cars and they can still do the job

Jackson is in a car sitting 4th in the championship. ATS is being made to look very amateur by Thompson in the same car.

crmalcolm · 22 Jul 2022, 10:16 (Ref:4120121)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

I think a mistype there; coverage starts on ITV from 12:00 according to the BTCC website.

Yes - my cut+paste didn't include the '1' before the 2:00

It should read:

12:00pm-3:00pm - ITV (races 16 and 17)
2:55pm-6:00pm - ITV4 (race 18)

billy bleach · 22 Jul 2022, 13:53 (Ref:4120133)

Quote:

Originally Posted by S griffin

Jackson and ATS are both good enough, it's just it's not working out for them atm. Put them in better cars and they can still do the job

Cammish and Sutton seem to be going alright. Maybe the overall standard has risen

3marinadrive · 22 Jul 2022, 16:11 (Ref:4120149)

Quote:

Originally Posted by S griffin

Jackson and ATS are both good enough, it's just it's not working out for them atm. Put them in better cars and they can still do the job

Totally disagree. Jackson had his a*%$ handed to him by Jake last year and now by both Sutton and Cammish. Still have no idea how he got the results he did in 2020...and AT-S was good back in the day (as was Chilton once) but since coming back has been out driven by Goff and Thompson....standard is very high at the front and these guys are just OK pay drivers and nothing more. Also Jackson is now in Hill's 2021 car so no excuses there either.

S griffin · 23 Jul 2022, 07:32 (Ref:4120190)

It seems to me the Ford is a tricky car to drive, so needs a top class driver to do the job. Ollie did a good enough job in 2020 and did do ok on occasion last year. He's had plenty of good results before that too. ATS seems to have lost a bit since he came back though

SSmith · 25 Jul 2022, 18:11 (Ref:4120498)

Current timetable for this weekend.

BTCC Quali - 15:30-16:00

BTCC Races - 12:08, 14:15, 17:10

https://www.barc.net/wp-content/uplo...ill_V6_ITV.pdf

SSmith · 25 Jul 2022, 18:42 (Ref:4120500)

Quote:

Originally Posted by 3marinadrive

Just before we start the second half of the season, we've had great discussion with some fellow BTCC fans/mates - gotta love a good old debate!

Based on performances in qualifying, race craft, overall pace, race results etc...we broke down the regular grid (excluding changes for Butel, Parfitt etc) and split the grid into three groups;

Elite - Quality - The Rest (couldn't think of any better titles!)

So the following list comes after much debate - and to be clear is just opinion of three old blokes who love BTCC, so here you go:

Each list is alphabetical by the way;

Elite 10 Drivers;

Butcher
Cammish
Cook
Hill
Ingram
Lloyd
Morgan
Sutton
Shedden
Turkington

Quality 10 drivers;

Chilton
Collard
Gamble
Jelley
Hand
Moffat
Patterson
Plato
Rowbottom
Thompson

The Rest - 9 Drivers

Butel
Crees
Edwards
Jackson
Hamilton
Osborne
Parfitt
Powell
Taylor-Smith

Lots of debate around the Elite group re Morgan, Rowbottom, Jelley, Plato, Moffat, Gamble...any of those could be in for sure....

Likewise Jackson, Edwards, Taylor-Smith moving into the 'Quality; group - everyone has their favourites and of course has an opinion ...this is ours, be interested to see everyone's thoughts and see their lists

Interesting final fact;

At the end of 2021 the top 7 Drivers were Sutton, Turkington, Cook, Ingram, Hill, Shedden and Butcher

At the half way point in 2022 the top 7 are....Ingram, Cook, Turkington, Sutton, Shedden, Butcher

Cream will rise I guess...!

That's a really interesting list! Based on 2022 alone, I think the only ways my list would differ would be to possibly swap Rowbottom and Morgan (a tough call - Rowbottom has had better pace for me, but Morgan has won a race), and swap Crees and Patterson.

To me, this year's grid seems like the strongest we've had for a while. We've still got some less-than-amazing drivers, but they seem better behaved (on the whole), with stronger pace, and there are fewer of them.

3marinadrive · 25 Jul 2022, 21:22 (Ref:4120506)

Quote:

Originally Posted by SSmith

That's a really interesting list! Based on 2022 alone, I think the only ways my list would differ would be to possibly swap Rowbottom and Morgan (a tough call - Rowbottom has had better pace for me, but Morgan has won a race), and swap Crees and Patterson.

To me, this year's grid seems like the strongest we've had for a while. We've still got some less-than-amazing drivers, but they seem better behaved (on the whole), with stronger pace, and there are fewer of them.

Funnily enough they were the ones we also deliberated the most about! Exactly those drivers - Rowbottom & Morgan swapping and Crees & Patterson...you could even argue for simply splitting the grid into two groups....!

SSmith · 26 Jul 2022, 13:46 (Ref:4120555)

Quote:

Originally Posted by 3marinadrive

Funnily enough they were the ones we also deliberated the most about! Exactly those drivers - Rowbottom & Morgan swapping and Crees & Patterson...you could even argue for simply splitting the grid into two groups....!

Great minds think alike!

If I were to go for two groups, I think this would be my selection.

'Top' group (14):

Butcher
Cammish
Cook
Hill
Ingram
Jelley
Lloyd
Moffat
Morgan
Plato
Rowbottom
Sutton
Shedden
Turkington

'Bottom' group (15):
Butel
Chilton
Collard
Crees
Edwards
Gamble
Hand
Hamilton
Jackson
Osborne
Parfitt
Patterson
Powell
Taylor-Smith
Thompson

I think the sheer amount of thinking/deliberating required to draw up these lists is testament to the series really.

S griffin · 26 Jul 2022, 14:26 (Ref:4120558)

Looking forward to this weekend, great to have the BTCC back. And part of it will be shown live on ITV1 again!

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