RHR wants to do F1

enemy-ace · 8 Jun 2004, 15:00 (Ref:997377)

It would appear that RHR has aspirations of F1.
IMO Still to early to judge how he might do if given the opportunity. Good to see a youmg american in the series although it would be CC's loss. What do you guys think?
http://f1.racing-live.com/en/index.html

Kicking-back · 8 Jun 2004, 15:01 (Ref:997380)

If he gets to F1, it would be good for Champ Car.

f1manoz · 8 Jun 2004, 15:51 (Ref:997438)

IMO most drivers do want to get to the pinnacle, even though that pinnacle produces dull races!

RHR is a talented, young fellow and considering most team bosses are saying they want an American in their cars, he should be on the short-list.

rush1 · 8 Jun 2004, 15:55 (Ref:997441)

Quote:

Originally posted by Kicking-back
If he gets to F1, it would be good for Champ Car.

Just like losing Montoya and JV to F1, right? I mean its the goal of any racing series. Get your promising young stars out of your own seires to formula 1.

Jordi · 8 Jun 2004, 16:44 (Ref:997496)

At least Montoya and Jacques drove in CART.
Remember also Montoya has a 100% winning percentage in the IRL, not sure if he's the best ever or if the competition was a bit grim.

enemy-ace · 8 Jun 2004, 16:48 (Ref:997504)

F1 is the top and to have your drivers go to F1 and perform well does in turn lend a certain credibilty to your series. It also makes itself more attractive to up and coming drivers who will want to use it as a stepping stone. I am grateful for having had the opportunity to see a driver of Montoya's calibre in Champ Car.
Better to have loved and lost than never to have loved at all!

Tailwind · 8 Jun 2004, 16:53 (Ref:997512)

If that is where RHR wants to go, I wish him good luck. He is talented. I don't know if we have seen all he can be yet. I think he is now with a team that will showcase what he is made of. I would love to see an American in F1.

mueber · 8 Jun 2004, 17:14 (Ref:997539)

I have aspirations of F-1 too. All I lack is talent. RHR may have that talent, and I, for one, would love the chance to cheer him, or any other American, on.

Snrub · 9 Jun 2004, 03:24 (Ref:998009)

I like it when guys have the ambition to win CART. I'm sure ever driver is willing to listen, but I prefer it when a driver is in the series they want to be in. If he leaves for F1 it will be a bad thing. This series needs another long term American driver for interest to rise. If I were a driver I'd seriously want to stay in CART rather than go to F1. Good drivers will always be competitive and will not constantly whitewash the field. If I were MS I'd be craving some competition.

BootsOntheSide · 9 Jun 2004, 10:16 (Ref:998220)

Quote:

Originally posted by Jordi
At least Montoya and Jacques drove in CART.
Remember also Montoya has a 100% winning percentage in the IRL, not sure if he's the best ever or if the competition was a bit grim.

The competition was pretty grim in 2000, but now it's got Hornish, Castro-Neves, Dixon, Wheldon, Rice, Franchitti, Barron, Kanaan and tonnes more. A stronger field than CART, IMO.

Drivers whose only use for CART is as a stepping stone for F1 can't be good for the series. As soon as these guys build up any status with the fans, they're gone.

The fact that RHR wants to go to F1, when US OW racing was good enough for Al Snr and Jr, Rutherford, Sneva, Vasser and all the rest should spark real concern among the leaders of the 2 championships - somewhere, a lot of appeal and status has been lost.

racinthestreets · 9 Jun 2004, 14:37 (Ref:998518)

The fact that RHR wants to go to F1, when US OW racing was good enough for Al Snr and Jr, Rutherford, Sneva, Vasser and all the rest should spark real concern among the leaders of the 2 championships - somewhere, a lot of appeal and status has been lost.

IMO RHR like many other drivers wants a F1 seat because of the mucho dinero $$$$$$

$$$$$$ that the drivers in F1 make, even the test drivers.

carsten66 · 9 Jun 2004, 15:47 (Ref:998581)

Okay... driving in F1 means a lot of money in the pockets - but the drivers take a lot of risk and often it doesn't work well for them... Andretti, Fittipaldi, Zanardi, DaMatta... F1 is a technical series, not a drivers series... and in the meantime the F1 seat-time is strongly suggestive of Dale Coyne's "rent a car program"... RHR is young, so I think he should stay in CART and win a championship first...

jjspierx · 9 Jun 2004, 16:02 (Ref:998595)

RHR wanting to goto F1 isn't new news. Thats been his goal all of his life, and he's talked about that for years. Its not like now that he's in Champcar, he's looking up to the next biggest series. I give him props for having such an ambition. F-1 is a dream for almost any young race car driver. Not only is the money huge, but you travel the world racing the fastest cars against the best drivers in the world and that is enough to draw in any race car driver. I'm not saying there aren't plenty of fast drivers in Champcar, but overall the quality of the drivers in F1 is superior. And the speed of the cars, even the Mindardi's is simply amazing compared to even a Champcar. Champcar can't hold a candle to the braking capability, cornering ability, or acceleration. To not want to experience driving a Formula 1 car even on a slower team for a season or two would be silly in my opinion for a driver like RHR.

Snrub · 9 Jun 2004, 19:37 (Ref:998912)

When you say Fittipaldi you mean Christian? IMO Christian looked better in F1 then he ever performed in CART.

As for F1 vs. CART ambitions, I honestly think there have been times where CART has had a better field and faster cars overall. Eg. 1999. I've mention this before and no one ever believes me on the car part, even when I prove it to them. I think it's more the prestige factor.

Jordi · 9 Jun 2004, 21:43 (Ref:999070)

I'm not sure about the car part, Snrub. Isn't there a 150 kg difference between both? Also, they are designed for different purposes anyway...

Snrub · 9 Jun 2004, 22:33 (Ref:999143)

Yes I know everyone doubts that. I'll run it down again:
1. Lap times have rising sharply since Michelin and the manufacturers (money, engine power) have gotten involved in F1.
2. In the afterglow of the tirewar CART ran stiky tires.
3. In '99 CART ran ~1100hp. Yes everyone ALWAYS says I'm full of it on that one. I don't care enough to dig up the proof again, but Dario is on the record in 2002 as saying that F1 would have looked bad if CART had visited Montreal in '99. Dario quotes the HP numbers and seeing as he was the guy who worked with Honda and got all the primo parts I think he's pretty credible. The engine manufacturers spent an incredible amount in CART, the head of TRD is on the record saying they spent $200M on CART in 2001. You don't spend that kind of money on a turbo engine of similar displacement to F1 and end up with less power.
4. Compare lap times between F1 back in '99 to what CART run at Montreal. There's not that much dispairity with far less power and harder tires. While there has been some chasis development in CART, it's been somewhat minimal since '99.

Amar7605 · 10 Jun 2004, 07:00 (Ref:999325)

Oh of course... Champ Cars at their prime would most likely kick the crud out of today's F1 cars.

Oh yeah, it would be nice if RHR goes to F1, but he should only go if he can get into a good team with a potential to win him a driver championship. I mean, if Minardi or Jaguar or Toyota comes knocking at the door, then slam it in their faces as hard as he can.

Herdez is a good, competitive team right now. And I am being seriious when I say that in a few years there is a potential to win a Champ Car title with them. So, unless he gets an offer from a really good F1 team, he should stay in Champ Cars.

Plus, there is also the notion that the only way that American fans would get interested in F1 is that there has to be a competitive American driver who can win.

rustyfan · 10 Jun 2004, 10:49 (Ref:999517)

Quote:

Originally posted by racinthestreets
IMO RHR like many other drivers wants a F1 seat because of the mucho dinero $$$$$$ $$$$$$ that the drivers in F1 make, even the test drivers.

Uh, yeah, if he were to land a ride with one of the top teams, but in the smaller teams (which would be his best chance unless he starts to utterly dominate Champ Car from now on, winning a ton of races and the championship) you can count on having to bring cash with you in order to get a seat, test-driver seat included.

In my opinion Scott Speed is closer to Formula 1 than Ryan Hunter-Reay is. Should be interesting to see how it pans out.

N I Tram · 10 Jun 2004, 12:40 (Ref:999611)

It'd be a real blow for CART if Ryan did switch, as he's precisely the kind of driver they want to attract - young, easily-marketable, monied to the point of never having to worry about where his next drive will come from, talented, and crucially American.

Now that the series is almost oval-free it should be keeping drivers like him, not sinply mopping up the guys who couldn't get into F1 (and, from their junior careers, ponly Bruno, Seb, Justin and maybe RHR have suggested that they have the talent - PT couldn't do it now)

jjspierx · 10 Jun 2004, 15:51 (Ref:999782)

Quote:

Originally posted by Snrub
4. Compare lap times between F1 back in '99 to what CART run at Montreal. There's not that much dispairity with far less power and harder tires. While there has been some chasis development in CART, it's been somewhat minimal since '99.

I'm not sure, but I was under the impression that when CART ran at Montreal it was slightly different than the configuration that F1 ran, to make Bernie Ecclestone happy. Even if CART did have 1100hp in 99, and we all know that they had stickier tires, they still didn't have carbon brakes and the ridiculous areodynamics that F1 did in 99. I looked up lap times from 99 for F1 and Champcar from 2003 and you are right the lap times are pretty similar, F1 being about 6/10ths quicker, but again I was under the impression that Champcar version of the track was slightly shorter.

jjspierx · 10 Jun 2004, 15:54 (Ref:999788)

Quote:

Originally posted by Amar7605
Oh of course... Champ Cars at their prime would most likely kick the crud out of today's F1 cars.

Oh yeah, it would be nice if RHR goes to F1, but he should only go if he can get into a good team with a potential to win him a driver championship. I mean, if Minardi or Jaguar or Toyota comes knocking at the door, then slam it in their faces as hard as he can.

There is no way that Champ Cars in their prime would ever have been able to beat an F1 car now. I'm not going to get into argument of an F1 car in 1999, as thats more plausible, but right now F1 cars are the peak of what they or any other series has ever been.

Chances of RHR going straight into a top team are slim to none. If he were offered a paying ride by Jaguar, Toyota, or even Mindardi he would be wise to take it. Many current F1 drivers got their start in Minardi.

macdaddy · 10 Jun 2004, 17:01 (Ref:999858)

jj... Montreal was identical for both series.

jjspierx · 10 Jun 2004, 17:30 (Ref:999894)

I stand corrected then.

carsten66 · 10 Jun 2004, 18:14 (Ref:999931)

Quote:

Originally posted by jjspierx
Chances of RHR going straight into a top team are slim to none. If he were offered a paying ride by Jaguar, Toyota, or even Mindardi he would be wise to take it. Many current F1 drivers got their start in Minardi.

I don't agree... none of the top or better drivers in F1 got their start in a Minardi... that's a illusion! And as a driver you never have the slightest chances to to get some points, see the podium or win a race... hmm, okay, perhaps when theten cars in front of you have a crash... I would desribe this job as full time frustration.

Snrub · 10 Jun 2004, 18:27 (Ref:999951)

I don't think a '99 spec CART car could beat the 2004 Ferraris either. Another factor to consider is that while F1 cars have more sophisticated aero, CART has undertrays. Just because it's technologically advanted doesn't mean it always uses the best routes to get that performance.

As for drivers starting at Minardi, what about Alonso? The most recent story would be Webber, everyone knows he's good and he's a top canidate to drive for Williams next year.

I think if I were a CART driver I'd stay put unless I had a shot with a top ride. Even then I'd have to weigh my options. Did Vasser make the right call by turning down BAR for the '98 season? You bet he did!

On your track configuration point jjspierx, I can understand why you were confused. Initially there was a lot of talk of the track being different or changing because of CART. I think they did change the pit areas when CART started to race there, but like Mac said F1 races on the same track.