A Third Manufacturer

[Panzer]

This has probably been discused before but being new i missed it. It seems to me people are against a third or fourth manufacturer entering the championship. Why ?
Wouldn't it create even more interest, and wouldn't a
Holden or Ford victory be even more sweeter. Surely Ford and Holden would welcome the challenge. Is there more to it than this or what. Thanks. :confused:

[Dirk]

I think it would be good from my point of view but we need to look at the fact that back in the Group A days that is what destroyed the racing. If a third or fourth manufacturer was entered into the championship the rules need to be retained, no special dispensations. And I see what you mean with the addition, it would become a battle of the "Aussie" cars against the "Jap built" cars.

[Panzer]

Yes Dirk, never thought about rules. Your right the rules would have to be the same, the new cars would have to comply to the current rules. Can you explain how other manufactures stuffed the championship up last time.
Thanks.

[Dirk]

With the Sierras and GTRs and technology back in the Group A days, the crowds at the events dwindled away, nobody wanted to watch them. Sorry I shouldn't say nobody but nothing like the numbers we see at events today. When the formula changed from Group A to V8 Supercar there was an influx of both spectators and competitors.

[smokinJ]

The competition was there but I think the average Joe was turned of when he saw all these cars and drivers he had never seen before taking out Bathurst
cars he couldn't buy in australia blitzing his old favourite driver in a commodore or a falcon
Also the escalating costs to run up the front of the competition coupled with the lack of gate takings and tv ratings
all brought about its death

Now the cars of today are nothing like the ones you buy
but then again the average Joe thinks his commodore or falcon is the same that is belting around the Mount

so under the current rules I would like to see a MitsiDodge
or a ToyLexus out there

[Dirk]

By keeping the rules I meant keep the pushrod engines, must be 4 door, and must be rearwheel drive.

[stoned pony]

I think the biggest stumbling block here is not so much other makes arriving and complying with the rules but geting them past Ford and Holden who believe they have ownership of the series because they basically paid for it to happen and pump millions in annually.
They would see the arrival of other manufacturers as someone riding in on their coat tails, making the most of the series after these two had done the hard yards.

[Panzer]

Thanks i understand a bit better now. Another queation, do either Toyota or not so squeezy make a V8 road car, and is it true that Holden and Ford share some parts on the race cars. :confused:

[Gudgeon]

another manufacturer running the same spec vehicle would give the series an enormous shot in the arm Ford and Holden will resist this as they have a vested interest in preserving the staus quo but Toyota as the biggest selling manufacturer in Australia should be represented
They have the engine from the truck series in USA and the body shell would not be a problem .
The extra commercial support would assist at least 3 ,2 car teams and their corporate presence can only enhance the series.
Lets hope that Tony Cochrane can make this happen

[Dirk]

All V8 Supercars run 9 inch Ford diffs and under Project Bluebprint there are a number of parts on the vehicles that are the same. However the bodyshell and the engines remain products of the manufacturers.

[Panzer]

Would that same set up with diff etc be able to be used on say a magna chassis or would the changes the Japs would have to make make it unviable. In fact are toy or mit interrested in joining the comp.
Thanks

[Dirk]

Well they would have to run the diff in the vehicles, anyone correct me if I am wrong but I believe that they run a solid read end??? If so Mitsu and Toyota would have to comply with this, otherwise with an independant rear end they would have a distinct advantage.

[Driver]

Both cars use the 9' diff (or really a variation of it) plus the same getrag gearbox. The VY uses double wishbone suspension at the front unlike the road car (strut) but again it is a variation of the Ford front end as even the Ford dosn't use the factory suspension.

Seeing any car that was to race under these rules would be purely a race car and nothing to do with the road car, just about anything car be done to a Magna/Camry to be able to run the same specs as the current cars.

[Panzer]

Thanks Guys .
Has there ever been a poll in a mag or on here in relation to other manufactures joining the championship. If so do you know what the results were.

[Dirk]

Not totally sure, but generally the people I have spoken to have the same opinion as I do, as long as it is kept fair.

[stoned pony]

Toyota and Mitsubishi have, from memory, expressed interest in running V8SC. Mits even had a guy out from Europe (I think) to have a look at a couple of races last year.

[Dirk]

Mitsubishi Australia said that they were interested but it doesn't fit into their plan at present.

[grumpy1]

I thought project Blueprint was to bring parity no matter what the manufactuor.The resistance is because Mitsbishi and Toyota have well developed motor sport intrestes overseas.Toyota ran a natural asperated push rod V8 in an indy car as a test last year.It was less than half a second slower than the real thing.Thats gotta scare the pants off Ford and Holden.

The Grumpy1
P.S. RallieArt produced 2 proto types last year with rear drive V8 push rod engines through a 6 speed box.Toyota took two Camrays to TOMS in Japan for the same reason early this year.

[SRabbit]

I read a report about 2-3 weeks ago that suggested Mitsubishi Australia already had one of it's front doors closed, and the chock holding the second one is not far from slipping with the chain and padlock flapping in the breeze. Bitsamissing Japan seemed reluctant last tim eto help, so I can't see them putting hand in pocket this time either, so realistically if the reports are true, Totota would be the only one with the funds to even try.

[aj_308]

Originally posted by Driver
Both cars use the 9' diff (or really a variation of it) plus the same getrag gearbox. The VY uses double wishbone suspension at the front unlike the road car (strut) but again it is a variation of the Ford front end as even the Ford dosn't use the factory suspension.

Seeing any car that was to race under these rules would be purely a race car and nothing to do with the road car, just about anything car be done to a Magna/Camry to be able to run the same specs as the current cars.

the cars use a 6 speed hollinger race box. a getrag would splatter all over the track with 600hp.

[Dirk]

Yeah I thought that they used Hollinger boxes but I thought I had missed a rule change somewhere so I didn't say anything.

[F|sh]

anyone no what happened to the V8 magna future tourer? that looked good and looked different in thatfield even if it did have bugger all sponsors on the thing.


wat be great to see another mnufacturer but i can only see it happening if toyota get access to NASCAR as TC follows NASCARS book to the letter

[grumpy1]

As I said it still lives over in Adelaide with its brother.

The Grumpy1

[Dirk]

No you didn't say grumpy1, you said it was produced last year but the Magna Future Tourer which ran a Holden engine was produced in 2000 I believe.

[stoned pony]

FIsh, you might be interested to know that Toyota is going to NASCAR either next year or 2006. I think they are already running Tundara trucks in the Craftsman Tools series.
V8, rear-drive Avalon, anyone?