Wirth Research - 'a very interesting coupe'

[Bentley03]

Endurance-Info.com have today posted a fascinating, and very open, interview with Nick Wirth.

Link to article

[joeb]

I wonder if he has a manufacturer in mind for the new car. A new HPD perhaps? or somebody new maybe Jaguar, Lotus....

[NightStalk3r]

I heard a while a go that he was working with Porsche on something, whether this is it or not i do not know.

[R4z3rw33n]

Originally Posted by NightStalk3r

I heard a while a go that he was working with Porsche on something, whether this is it or not i do not know.

Porsche Motorsport have long been listed as a client on the WirthResearch web page. Not exactly sure what services Wirth provide to them.

Nissan perhaps? /Wishful thinking

[joeb]

Thinking about the quote "very interesting coupe" I wonder what he meant. Personally, I think all LMP's are interesting, so I wonder what constitutes interesting for Nick. He came up with rears on the front, so what is next?

[knighty]

I read that interview with great interest, but it did not give me the impression that he actually had a customer, otherwise why was he shouting about it!!!!......quite the opposite actually, I got the impression he was using that interview as a megaphone to potential new LMP manufacturers looking for a design partner, its really not uncommon for UK based advanced engineering companies (powertrain, gearbox, chassis, electronics, hybrid etc) to construc build and test a "technology demonstrator" and not actually sell it to anybody, the public perception being "well that was a failure" what the general public dont realise that that paricular technology demonstrator won them a shed load of work on other major projects............believe me, I'm surrounded by companies doing it.

while I agree he is probably helping porsche......after seeing the porsche LMP2 car ...... I really would be surprised to see them sub-contract out a major portion of an LMP1 car......porsche generate huge revenue from their engineering consultancy side of the business and it pays to portray that everything (well everything major) is home grown.

[gwyllion]

Porsche has a very good starting point for a future LMP1 car. The engine and gearbox of the RS Spyder can be reused.

[zac510]

Is this not unlike the model that Dome tried with the S102? Build a chassis and then try and sell it to a manufacturer.. Why do Wirth think they will be more successful than Dome?

[Gil Abobeleira]

Maybe they'll use a bigger tire at the front than at the back

[zac510]

Ingenious plan Gil!

[joeb]

Originally Posted by knighty

I read that interview with great interest, but it did not give me the impression that he actually had a customer, otherwise why was he shouting about it!!!!......quite the opposite actually, I got the impression he was using that interview as a megaphone to potential new LMP manufacturers looking for a design partner, its really not uncommon for UK based advanced engineering companies (powertrain, gearbox, chassis, electronics, hybrid etc) to construc build and test a "technology demonstrator" and not actually sell it to anybody, the public perception being "well that was a failure" what the general public dont realise that that paricular technology demonstrator won them a shed load of work on other major projects............believe me, I'm surrounded by companies doing it.

while I agree he is probably helping porsche......after seeing the porsche LMP2 car ...... I really would be surprised to see them sub-contract out a major portion of an LMP1 car......porsche generate huge revenue from their engineering consultancy side of the business and it pays to portray that everything (well everything major) is home grown.

I read the interview as an ad for a manufacturer to join in as well. Duncan Dayton has said he wants his team to be aligned with a manufacturer, and so does Nick. If I were a manufacturer thinking about LeMans I would seriously consider putting both of the aforementioned groups to work!

[ubrben]

Originally Posted by zac510

Is this not unlike the model that Dome tried with the S102? Build a chassis and then try and sell it to a manufacturer.. Why do Wirth think they will be more successful than Dome?

Based on that verbal diarrhoea on the Dome website the other day, being less naive is an obvious area where Wirth is stronger...

Let's not forget that the Acura P1 car got pole at Sebring last year ahead of Audi and Peugeot, the P2 won LMP2 in America last year and was fully competitive against Porsche's LMP2 on all circuit types in 2008.

Finally the HPD LMP2 with low-drag aero is currently utterly dominating the LMS pace-wise. It was 10km/h faster in a straightline than the Porsche was last year at Spa and faster in the middle sector this weekend than the Audi at times.

This compared with Dome who've never won a thing in LMS, ALMS or at Le Mans...

Ben

[zac510]

Oh no doubt Wirth can build a good car. But building a sportscar before you even have a buyer while ruling out privateer buyers is what I'm questioning.

[Mal]

Originally Posted by zac510

Oh no doubt Wirth can build a good car. But building a sportscar before you even have a buyer while ruling out privateer buyers is what I'm questioning.

Is he really ruling them out or is he making it appear beyond their reach so they want it more and he can charge a higher price for it.

[Fogelhund]

Originally Posted by zac510

Oh no doubt Wirth can build a good car. But building a sportscar before you even have a buyer while ruling out privateer buyers is what I'm questioning.

There is no build... just a design (concept?) in a computer.

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

There is no build... just a design (concept?) in a computer.

Yes, but a fully designed car in CFD these days is a bit more than merely 'just' a concept. No?




L.P.

[Fogelhund]

Originally Posted by HORNDAWG

Yes, but a fully designed car in CFD these days is a bit more than merely 'just' a concept. No?

Note, the concept was in brackets with a question mark. I have no idea to what stage this "design" is, really nobody here does. I can theorize that a final design couldn't take place, until Wirth knows what engine might be placed in such a car. Different engine configurations would require different cooling, placements, suspension differences and so on. Even a design that is "somewhat" complete, could require quite a bit of rework, to fit whatever manufacture "might" sign-on. For that reason, I suggested, that maybe this was a concept, as much as a finished project.

Overall, the main point was that there wasn't a finished real car.

[ubrben]

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

Note, the concept was in brackets with a question mark. I have no idea to what stage this "design" is, really nobody here does. I can theorize that a final design couldn't take place, until Wirth knows what engine might be placed in such a car. Different engine configurations would require different cooling, placements, suspension differences and so on. Even a design that is "somewhat" complete, could require quite a bit of rework, to fit whatever manufacture "might" sign-on. For that reason, I suggested, that maybe this was a concept, as much as a finished project.

Overall, the main point was that there wasn't a finished real car.

I'm not sure there's as much variation as you suggest.

The engine of a 2011 P1 is going to be a 3,4L atmo engine = Judd, HPD, Porsche? V8 or a 2L Turbo I4 - AER, Mazda. Or a Diesel with smaller capacity than current P1 engines. This is all in the draft regs.

Some form of hybrid will be allowed, and that mean Flybrid or Williams flywheel system or Marelli / Zytek, etc electrical system

You can do a huge amount of design before knowing exact details without being too far off.

Ben

[gwyllion]

FYI another look at the Wirth Researh similator: http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2010/1...ing-simulator/

In the buildup of Le Mans we already saw some pictures of it, when the Highcroft drivers were using it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DQTQjRVsoV4

[Aysedasi]

Thanks for that gwyllion, nice little video (good quality too!). Yes, the simulator is also shown in the Strakka DVD - which isn't at all bad.

[gwyllion]

Apparently Alonso used the simulator in his Renault days: http://formula-one.speedtv.com/artic...e-in-valencia/

A bit offtopic but this is Red Bull one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rE-Fge3gN9w

[Aysedasi]

I'm thinking of having one in my study..........

[The Badger]

Originally Posted by joeb

He came up with rears on the front, so what is next?

Fronts on the rear perhaps !!!

[gwyllion]

Originally Posted by The Badger

Fronts on the rear perhaps !!!

That has been done in the past with the Bentley LMGTP cars

In the interview RLM had with Darren Davis of Wirth Research (listen here), he believed that more manufacturers will use the wider front tyres because it gives a clear performance advantage. So I guess their LMP1 coupe will keep the big tyres.

[deggis]

Originally Posted by gwyllion

A bit offtopic but this is Red Bull one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rE-Fge3gN9w

More offtopic, the Williams one:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3KUfd4v0Gg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8zpCT-GgAYk

They all seem quite similar. I'd like to see this kind of videos of the McLaren sim, which at least was touted as the best one. Wirth's simulator was also shown on the Speedtv's Acura P1 program that was aired before Sebring last year.

Red Bull's sim is actually based on rFactor Pro. rFactor ('Non-Pro') is a commercial game that can be bought for 15 €... they're also using 3rd party mod tracks, so they're definitely not as accurate as laser scanned tracks that at least Williams partly uses. and you can buy this one (for the price of a car ) and use pretty much any commercial game with it. It's the software and the used data that makes these Wirth, Williams or Red Bull sims a bit more special.