Help needed with historic calendar - 1930s

[TimD]

Hope someone can help with these. Despite much research I am unable to pin down dates for certain events. If there's anyone who can help with these, I'd be very grateful.

I'm looking for the dates when the following events took place:

1931 Argentine Grand Prix
1931 Ulster Trophy
1932 Avusrennen
1932 Belgian Grand Prix
1932 Czech Grand Prix, Brno
1932 La Baule Grand Prix
1932 Miramas Grand Prix
1933 Alpine Trial
1933 Nice Grand Prix
1933 Tunis Grand Prix
1934 Alpine Trial
1934 Parma-Poggio di Berceto Race
1934 Nuffield Trophy, Donington
1934 Paris-St Raphael Rally
1934 Ulster Trophy
1935 Coppa d'Oro
1935 Dieppe Voiturette GP
1935 Paris-St Raphael Rally
1935 Pau Grand Prix
1935 Phoenix Park Trophy
1935 Spanish Grand Prix
1936 Alpine Rally
1936 Budapest Grand Prix
1936 Cork 200 mile Handicap
1936 County Down Trophy
1936 Donington 12 hours
1936 British Voiturette GP, Donington
1936 French Grand Prix
1936 Manx 200
1936 Spa-Francorchamps Sports Car GP
1937 Cork Grand Prix
1937 Coronation Trophy, Donington
1937 Eifel Grand Prix
1937 Florence Grand Prix
1937 French Grand Prix
1937 Pau Grand Prix
1937 Ulster Trophy
1937 Vila Real Grand Prix
1938 Antwerp Grand Prix
1938 Paris-St Raphael Rally
1938 Phoenix Park Races
1938 Rio de Janeiro Grand Prix
1939 Paris-St Raphael Rally
1939 Tobruk-Tripoli Race

If anyone can come up with some of these, I shall be so grateful.

[Darren Galpin]

1935 Dieppe Voiturette GP - 20 July
1935 Spanish Grand Prix - 22 September
1935 III Grand Prix de Pau - 24 February
1937 Coronation Trophy - wasn't that at Crystal Palace?
1938 VI Grande Prêmio da Cidade de Rio de Janeiro - 12 June
1938 Antwerp GP was a sportscar race.

[TimD]

Wow! Thanks Darren.

I wasn't expecting anything quite so quickly.

I've suspected the Antwerp event was a sports car race, as the only entrants I've got for it so far are driving Delahaye 135s.

The Coronation Trophy - I've got a full entry list for the Crystal Palace race, but I've also got a cryptic note referring to another race at Donington with Bill Esplen and Charlie Martin competing - and they weren't at Crystal Palace.

The plot thickens.

Thanks once again.

[Dani Filth]

1932 Czech , September 4
1932 Miramas Grand Prix, September 25
1933 Nice Grand Prix , August 6
1933 Tunis Grand Prix , March 26
1935 Pau Grand Prix , February 24
1935 Spanish Grand Prix, September 22
1936 Budapest Grand Prix June21

just a few ... check them

[TimD]

Thank you Dani. That's cleared up a few more.

And I've just discovered another problem - can anyone tell me which car Tazio Nuvolari was driving in the 1936 Budapest event? I've got references for 8-cylinder and 12-cylinder Alfa Romeos.

Aargh!

[Yimkin]

TimD,

I believe you'll find a lot of what you are looking for on:

http://www.kolumbus.fi/leif.snellman/main.htm

It's an excellent site!

[TimD]

It is indeed, Yimkin. It is indeed. Trouble is - I'm finding references which come up with other answers, so I'm trying to pin things down for sure.

Leif's site is probably correct, but I need to be able to definitively rule out some of my other sources - a lot of which, sadly, don't have their bibliographies available.

(You wait - I've got plans to do the same exercise for the 1950s soon....!)

[Vitesse]

1932 Avus May 22nd S V
There was no 1932 Belgian GP!
1932 Czech GP/Masarykuv Okruh Sept 4th S V
1932 La Baule GP Aug 17th S
1932 Miramas GP - this was actually the Marseille GP Sept 25th S
1933 Nice GP Aug 6th S
1933 Tunis GP Mar 29th S

S = Sheldon
V = Venables "Racing 1500s"

More tonight if no-one beats me to them!

All references I've got give Nuvolari in in an 8C-35:

"It was decided to use the older cars as it was felt that the extra power of the V12 might be excessive on the tight circuit" (Venables - First Among Champions p114)

[Rob29]

Originally posted by TimD
Wow! Thanks Darren.

I wasn't expecting anything quite so quickly.

I've suspected the Antwerp event was a sports car race, as the only entrants I've got for it so far are driving Delahaye 135s.

The Coronation Trophy - I've got a full entry list for the Crystal Palace race, but I've also got a cryptic note referring to another race at Donington with Bill Esplen and Charlie Martin competing - and they weren't at Crystal Palace.

The plot thickens.

Thanks once again.

A Coronation Trophy meeting was held at Donington on Coronation Day-one page report in 'The Motor Sport Book of Donington' by W.Boddy. This is actually the old Motor Sport reports.Another Coronation Trophy held at Donington on May 14 1938.

[Rob29]

Now for Irish history! There was no Ulster Trophy in 1931-do you mean the RAC TT held in Ulster which was on Aug 22?
1934- actually called the County Down Trophy (@ Bangor )June 30.
1935-June 22.
1936-June 20.
Cork GP-1936-May 16
1937-May 22

[Elioss]

1934 Nuffield Trophy, Donington - 6th October
1935 Paris-St Raphael Rally - 27th February-2nd March
1935 Phoenix Park Trophy - 14th September
1936 French Grand Prix - 28th June at Montlhery
1937 Eifel Grand Prix - 13th June
1937 French Grand Prix - 4th July at Montlhery
1937 Pau Grand Prix - 21st February
1938 Antwerp Grand Prix - 22nd May

[TimD]

Elioss, welcome to the forum. Great to have you aboard.

Elioss, Rob and Vitesse, thank you. That ties up more loose ends. I take it that my rather Anglicised references for the Antwerp GP are for the same event as the GP d'Anvers? Now that I compare dates, I see I've got the same top five place finishers for both!

Rob, the 1934 County Down Trophy race - I'm quite prepared to run with this, but it needs to have been an event in which a team of Aston Martins finished 3rd,6th and 7th (Fotheringham/Driscoll/Penn-Hughes). Does this match with what you have?

[Vitesse]

1937 Florence GP June 13th S V
1937 Eifel GP June 13th S
1937 French GP and Pau GP were sports car races. French GP July 4th, Pau GP Feb 21st VB
1936 French GP was a sports car race too - Elioss' date is correct
1938 Rio GP June 12th E

E = Hans Etzrodt
VB = Venables Bugatti

[Vitesse]

1937 Vila Real GP Jul 25th E (unpublished info)
1939 Tobruk-Tripoli Mar 26th
1934 Nuffield Trophy Oct 7th V

I think we've more or less broken the back of this lot Tim, but what is the Coppa d'Oro? Sounds to me like an alternate name for something else ....

[TimD]

You're going to hate me for this. All I've got is that Carlo Pintacuda won it in a Lancia. Absolutely no other clues whatsoever.

I suspect that - like many of these problem events listed above - I've culled a tiny note from a Veteran and Vintage Magazine, and tucked it away in a database expecting something to come up sooner or later.

It's usually V&V magazine that does this to me. Fascinating articles that persist in skimming the surface of their subjects. At least by 21st century historians' standards. In those days, of course, the taste was for flavour of writing rather than sheer data. That's why Bill Boddy and Cyril Posthumus are so revered, and are yet so involving to glean hard information from.

By the way - what's the David Venables book on Bugatti you refer to? If it's as good as his reputation might suggest, and might even give me a chance of getting to the bottom of which club racer drove which Bugatti at Brooklands, then I suspect I need it for my library urgently!

[Rob29]

Originally posted by TimD


Rob, the 1934 County Down Trophy race - I'm quite prepared to run with this, but it needs to have been an event in which a team of Aston Martins finished 3rd,6th and 7th (Fotheringham/Driscoll/Penn-Hughes). Does this match with what you have?

NO-what you are looking for is the RAC Tourist Trophy (often known as the Ulster TT-as held at Ards 1928-36.Sorry no date to hand for that one but there is a book on the subject!
The Ulster Trophy was first held in 1937 at Ballyclare,replacing the County Down Trophy,as street racing was banned in NI following accident at Ards 1936. Since when only country lane racing,and that only for bikes since 1955.

[Dani Filth]

I forgot to say my source ... www.tazionuvolari.it

yep Nuvolari in 8C-35 in Budapest 36

[Darren Galpin]

Anvers = Antwerp = Antwerpen
(French, English, Flemish)

[Vitesse]

Originally posted by TimD
You're going to hate me for this. All I've got is that Carlo Pintacuda won it in a Lancia. Absolutely no other clues whatsoever.

I suspect that - like many of these problem events listed above - I've culled a tiny note from a Veteran and Vintage Magazine, and tucked it away in a database expecting something to come up sooner or later.

Found it! It's in Monkhouse/King-Farlow, as the Littorio Gold Cup. A "Round Italy" race of 3534 miles. Better known as the Giro d'Italia - production sports cars by the look of it, Pintacuda was in a Lancia Astura and I've found references to Fiat 508s too. But I can't find exact dates anywhere - apart from a reference that says it was a seven-day event. Seems to have been a similar event to the Tour de France, with special stages and regularity tests - nearer rally than race methinks....

Originally posted by TimD
By the way - what's the David Venables book on Bugatti you refer to? If it's as good as his reputation might suggest, and might even give me a chance of getting to the bottom of which club racer drove which Bugatti at Brooklands, then I suspect I need it for my library urgently!

Good general racing history, similar to his Alfa book, but not detailed enough for your purposes I think Tim. And his bibliography only lists the 1950 edition of WB's book, not the new edition. Brief review in September Motor Sport.

[Dani Filth]

http://www.racer.demon.nl/6thgear/gp-yby.html

check this one .. this is big

[Vitesse]

1934 Alpine Trial 7-12 August

http://www.jag-lovers.org/include/iv...35cat_15_l.jpg

Date on winner's plaque, top right of the picture!

[M Coupe]

Tim,

As others have said the Miramas race in 1932 was
1st GP Automobile de Marseille on the 25th Sept. Additionally it was a 400km race and was won by Raymond SOMMER in a Alfa Romeo 8C (average speed 175.65km/h), a certain Mr NUVOLARI was 2nd in an Alfa.

In 1933 the 2nd GP Automobile de Marseille took place on the 27th August. This time over 500km, and won by Louis CHIRON (average speed 179km/h). NUVOLARI was on pole but retired while in 3rd.

Next event was in 1936 where 2 races took place the 3 hour Automobiles de Marseille and the Coupe de Provence. The latter won by Amedee GORDINI in a Fiat. The 3h race was won by 'MICH PARIS' in a Delahaye 135s, the Delahaye filled the first 6 places. These races took place on the 24th May.

1937 was the final Miramas event 13 years after it opened. The 3 hour Automobiles de Marseille took place on the 6th June. On this occasion it was a bit strange. They ran different layouts for each hour (as seperate races) and the aggregate was used to find the overall winner. Miramas is basically an oval with 2 very tight chicanes (mini hairpin bends really.
The 1st hour they used both chicanes. This was won by WIMILLE in a Bugatti, followed by SOMMER in a Talbot. The 2nd hour had 1 chicane and was won by SOMMER, WIMILLE was 3rd. The 3rd hour had no chicane, again SOMMER won, but WIMILLE retired and COMOTTI in another Talbot finished 2nd. The overall result was the same. Average speeds were (1st hr 137.6km/h, 2nd hr 159.1km/h and 3rd hr 181.5km/h).

[Vitesse]

Parma-Poggio di Berceto was a hillclimb/mountain climb, not a race as such. Several Italian websites translate it as an "uphill race". Can't find an exact date for 1934, but probably late May, perhaps the 26th - it was on the 25th in 1933!

[Vitesse]

1936 British Voiturette GP, Donington

No such animal! Take your pick from the JCC 200 on Aug 29th (Seaman) or the Nuffield Trophy on July 4th (Charlie Martin). I think the JCC race is more likely, as the Nuffield was a handicap.

Or maybe the RAC Light Car Race at Douglas? That was May 28th and won by Seaman too, which probably doesn't help.

[TimD]

You know, you're a bona fide genius, Vitesse.

By the look of it, my note relates to the JCC 200, for which I've got (I think) a full set of runners and riders listed under the correct race title.