|
||||||||||
|
||||||||||
4 Dec 2002, 20:16 (Ref:442772) | #1 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 1,421
|
Why doesn't anyone criticise Kimi Raikkonen?
I mean, whenever Juan makes an error, everyone says "He's useless" and whenever Kimi makes an error, its "Oh, he's just inexperienced". Same with mechanical failures. Juan, "He broke the car again" Kimi, "Oh, that was bad luck". I bet that if Juan had gone off the track in France 2002 on the oil, everyone would be criticising him for throwing the lead away, but with Kimi it's bad luck?! You can't have it both ways
Come on, neither of these drivers is perfect, and both need to sort their consistency out before they have a hope of the WDC. Kimi is good, but he is NOT God. |
|
|
4 Dec 2002, 21:00 (Ref:442799) | #2 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Sep 1998
Posts: 2,762
|
Its the same old self fulfilling prophecy from the press all over again. He comes with a championship and his name on the Borg Warner trophy and they tout him as the next Senna or Schumacher. When he fails to live up to their unimaginable ideal as the next god of motorsport, they slag him off as merely a reckless charger or unpolished. Never mind the fact that no one could keep up with either Ferrari this year. Had he been in Schumacher's car all year then the hype would still be piling on.
Kimi on the other hand comes in without the pedigree and the expectations were lower because of the lack of performance from McLaren and Mercedes. Any problems he has are written off. Montoya doesn't get that luxury. To his eternal credit he does not let that bother him. It goes on all the time. DC has never gotten a bit of credit for being a challenger, even when the McLaren was inferior to two other marques on the grid. The fact is they are all fantastic drivers, every one. What makes them great is the intangible quality Senna and Schumacher brought to a great and powerful team. Senna I think was a purer racer than Schumacher, but could never pull a team together and focus them as well as the German. |
||
__________________
Never forget #99 |
4 Dec 2002, 21:21 (Ref:442816) | #3 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 5,577
|
Excellent points KC, particularly your last one about Schu and Senna. I fully agree with you that no one criticises Kimi because he came from no where and therefore anything he achieves, however minor, is seen as superb. Imagine if it had been JPM loosing it on the oil at France, the vultures would have gone for his throat. But for Kimi it was regarded as one of the greatest drives of the year.
|
||
__________________
Brought to you by Glagnar's Human Rinds: "A-bunch-a-munch-crunch-a-human" |
4 Dec 2002, 21:23 (Ref:442817) | #4 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 13,211
|
imagine the stick if it had been JPM who took Taku out during qualifying at Monza!!
|
||
__________________
That's so frickin uncool man! |
4 Dec 2002, 21:25 (Ref:442820) | #5 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 5,602
|
good point !.....but i think that just goes to show that some one the critism that JPM got this season was unjustified doesnt it !.......
|
|
__________________
MOTOR RACING ...The general idea is that the driver behind uses all his Skills, Tricks and Courage to try and overtake the guy ( or Girl ) in front ! |
4 Dec 2002, 21:27 (Ref:442824) | #6 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 5,577
|
At least we stood firm lads .
|
||
__________________
Brought to you by Glagnar's Human Rinds: "A-bunch-a-munch-crunch-a-human" |
4 Dec 2002, 21:28 (Ref:442825) | #7 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 1,354
|
Kimi and Juan are not quite on the same level experiencewise
|
|
__________________
GP Driver meeting - Coulthard to Taku: "I wouldn´t have tried that move on Barrichello." Taku to Coulthard: "I know..." |
4 Dec 2002, 21:32 (Ref:442831) | #8 | |||
Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 13,211
|
Quote:
|
|||
__________________
That's so frickin uncool man! |
4 Dec 2002, 21:36 (Ref:442837) | #9 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2000
Posts: 7,491
|
Who is criticising JPM? Who dares?? Let me at him!! Oh!! I forget - this thread is about Kimi; sorry! :confused:
|
||
|
4 Dec 2002, 21:41 (Ref:442840) | #10 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 5,073
|
I think that Kimi is actually Mika H in disguise!
The rest of you are spot on though. Kimi has arrived out of nowhere, so to speak so he does seem to have a teflon personna right now. JPM gets what, 7 poles out of a nowhere car and he gets slagged-off! Love this forum! While I will still not say who may be my favorite, I think JPM will be the man to watch next season. Williams gives him any kind of car and look out! |
||
__________________
"He's still a young guy and I always think, slightly morbidly, the last thing you learn is how to die and at the end of the day everybody learns every single day." - The Ever-Cheerfull Ron Dennis on Lewis Hamilton. |
4 Dec 2002, 22:06 (Ref:442852) | #11 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2000
Posts: 7,491
|
Let's be fair. Kimi has no personality, he appears extremely introverted. BUT he has talent - and that's what brings the car home ahead of DC.
|
||
|
4 Dec 2002, 22:16 (Ref:442869) | #12 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 1,421
|
Quote:
Or if JPM had been the one who kept his foot down through the engine smoke at Spa!! |
||
|
4 Dec 2002, 22:18 (Ref:442874) | #13 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 1,421
|
Quote:
|
||
|
4 Dec 2002, 22:22 (Ref:442882) | #14 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 1,421
|
Quote:
I think Kimi did have a personality until McLaren signed him and put him through the whole "PR speak" training scheme. |
||
|
4 Dec 2002, 23:13 (Ref:442933) | #15 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 11,293
|
Juan needs a brain implant, Kimi needs a personality transplant.
Only joking Juan, go for it! |
||
|
4 Dec 2002, 23:50 (Ref:442955) | #16 | ||
14th
1% Club
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 44,023
|
IMHO Kimi's personality hasn't changed at all since joining McClaren. Except now he can fit into the perceived situation that exists at McClaren.
He didn't say much when he was at Sauber and he doesn't say a lot now he is at McClaren. So what? It's better than talking rubbish all the time. Also. No one talks about anyone who isn't Michael (or Montoya to a lesser extent) - hence my earlier call for a Michael forum to distinguish this from the F1 forum. (I'm not saying this is a bad thing - just a little joke). The fact that no one criticises/talks about Kimi is a (sad?) reflection on us discussers, not the driver himself. After he has beaten Michael (or Montoya) a few times then there will be plenty of critisism!!!!!!! The Kimi/Mika thing is comedy too. Both are Finns. But, more importantly, both just go about enjoying their sport, being good at it, and not talking rubbish all the time. That's it. And they are quick F1 drivers. Cool. After that rant. Kimi is great. Not the Finnished (sic) article yet, but a very enjoyable GP driver. |
||
__________________
Brum brum |
5 Dec 2002, 00:11 (Ref:442967) | #17 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2000
Posts: 7,491
|
Actually we have had quite good discussions about Kimi, and why he was selected by Ron ahead of Nick. I have posted before that Kimi has a very steep learning curve, and I would not be surprised if he was regularly battling it out with the front runners in the next two years. If Mclaren improved to a level similar to Ferrari, I would not be surprised if Kimi becomes WDC. It does show that Peter sauber made the right decision when he wanted to hire this young driver who was hardly proven in F3 or F3000. He saw the brilliance even then.
Just don't expect long humourous discussions at the post race conferences. He doesn't have the humour nor the personality of Mika, but then that will not detract from his driving. |
||
|
5 Dec 2002, 00:18 (Ref:442970) | #18 | ||
14th
1% Club
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 44,023
|
Good point Valve, there have been some good discussions about Kimi.
A lot of people didn't see the personality in Mika, so what hope does Kimi! have Kimi drives very well and speaks about the sport in a good way too. I love to watch him drive. Great stuff. |
||
__________________
Brum brum |
5 Dec 2002, 01:03 (Ref:442994) | #19 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 11,293
|
Did that crash Hakkinen had in 95 damage his brain? His speech always seemed stemmed as if it were a side effect of his crash.
|
||
|
5 Dec 2002, 01:40 (Ref:443010) | #20 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 2,986
|
I came here to make a Kimmi vs. Juan post. This is good enough! At the start of the year I was ready to say that JPM was the best racer on the F1 grid but Kimmi impressed me. He has made me a believer.
I don't think Kimmi gets "dissed" here and by the media because he does not say too much. Most of his talking is done on the track with the car. I mean he lacks personality but how many times can we write about that? I think he needs to be a bit more open to the press. At this time I think he would be an even worse representative than MS for F1. Not because he lacks ethics but because he would be boring. If/when Montoya becomes champ it will spark debates, praises and parties worldwide. He is the closest to an American driver. Being from south America he has most of the Latin support and racing from a British team... need I say more. JPM also has personality. He is hot blooded in the car but easy going in the rest of his life. He is not snobbish like our present rep. Kimmi and Juan are the future of F1. Hopefully they both will bring years of rivalry and great FAIR racing. I have great respect for KR and with an "attitude adjustment" he can will provide us with great racing and the press with great quotes. |
||
__________________
Eventually we learn |
5 Dec 2002, 02:08 (Ref:443019) | #21 | ||
Racer
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 459
|
I have a great picture of Sato demostrating passing with his hands to Kimi in the McLaren garage at Monza. I think Kimi takes his fair share of criticism when he screws up but thats not too often. Thats why it may seem like no one ever has anything bad to say about him and after all a lot happens in one season so its easy to forget and move on to the next topic. As for his personality, to each his own. Im a bit introverted myself and that rubs people the wrong way sometimes but it depends on the situation. Im sure Kimis a great guy in his own enviroment (he may distance himself emotionally from racing) but in front of the TV cameras its just a different story.
|
||
__________________
"What's the point? We have no power. Are we going to put 'Loser' on the sidepod for a sponsor?" - John Menard |
5 Dec 2002, 02:17 (Ref:443020) | #22 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 11,293
|
Well no ones got anything bad to say about him as he never actually does anything on track to "set the world alight".
He's like DC and Mika - another "solid" (ie boring) driver. The only time we saw him light up was when he was under threat by Montoya at Hockenheim when all of a sudden he got very defencive, in fact a bit like how Ralf gets all showy when Juan tries to pass him. |
||
|
5 Dec 2002, 05:19 (Ref:443051) | #23 | ||
Ten-Tenths Hall of Fame
Veteran
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 5,181
|
Sorry to break up the JPM love-in, but NiceGuyEddie is right, Kimi and Juan are *not even close* in racing experience, and that is why a mistake or two could be expected from Kimi (though he made very very few) this year, while from Juan, they are less excusable. The fact that they started in F1 as regular drivers the same year doesn't really tell the whole story.
Kimi *started racing cars* in 1999. In 1999, JPM had already been racing cars for 7 years (Formula Renault in '92), had been signed as a Williams test driver for two years, and oh yeah, won the CART driver's championship. The following year, while Kimi was struggling to get a superlicence having only 23 car races under his belt, JPM was busy winning the Indy 500. Last edited by Inigo Montoya; 5 Dec 2002 at 05:22. |
||
__________________
"And the most important thing is that we, the Vettels, the Bernies, whoever, should not destroy our own sport by making stupid comments about the ******* noise." - Niki Lauda |
5 Dec 2002, 05:22 (Ref:443052) | #24 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 2,083
|
"Did that crash Hakkinen had in 95 damage his brain? His speech always seemed stemmed as if it were a side effect of his crash"
I don't think so monster(or is that MR monster?).Although it's true his brain was starved of Ox for a little bit,it was nowhere near enough to cause any damage.Besides,it's just his weird way of talking.Fins just sound very odd to us. |
||
|
5 Dec 2002, 05:48 (Ref:443057) | #25 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 2,157
|
Hakkinen was left partially deaf in one ear and also partially paralysed on one side of his face from the crash. The doctors also said that if he had another shunt like that he would be dead - thumbs up to him for coming back and it kinda explains why he wasnt always willing to overtake if it wasnt for a win.
Kimi has no experience compared to JPM and never says he is as good as TGF and so he never gives us anything to knock down unlike JPM!! But you are right - they are both excellent drivers. |
|
__________________
Racing is in my...err... I was born to...um... Winning is...things and stuff...etc.. For sure! |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
Kimi Raikkonen Superstar | Armco Bender | Formula One | 23 | 7 Apr 2003 14:53 |
What did you think to Kimi Raikkonen? | Raven | Formula One | 48 | 7 Mar 2002 17:52 |
kimi raikkonen... | gomick | National & International Single Seaters | 12 | 4 Oct 2001 22:23 |