Banging Wheels, paddock talk and the laws of physics....

speedy king · 7 Dec 2004, 19:13 (Ref:1173713)

When i started karting some years back one of my biggest fears was bashing wheels. It soon came apparent to me though that bashing wheels is very common and i soon found that i had done it a few times. I always presumed though that if you banged wheels the kart would go air born and possibly flip however thankfully this has never actually ahppened to me and in my years of both racing and spectating i have only ever seen one flip nose first over the back of another kart.

I have been trying to work out for ages what is safe and what isn't. Obviously bashing wheels is going to happen at some time and it'll be difficult if not impossible to win a race by not taking those risks unless your starting from pole, after all, it's wheel to wheel racing. However, i was told that in Rotax Max, due to the weight of the karts to flip you really need to hit the back unprotected wheel at quite a force. Otherwise, if you bang wheels side on chances are you should be ok. I have done this and always survived, however one thing i have noticed when i've seen people collide infront is it's nearly always in this scenario the kart on the right which bumps up in the air as the engines are on the right, therefore the left kart is heavier than the one on the right so the obvious thing to happen is the kart on the right to get a little bit air born.

I'm asking this because i have seen so many thing happen when i'm just waiting for a kart to bounce up in the air and it dosent so just wondered how common it is and if anyone can shine any more myths on top of mine of paddock talk, for example, if a kart spins infront it's advisable to aim for it, as chances are it'll either spin to the left or right......

Alex Hodgkinson · 8 Dec 2004, 16:12 (Ref:1174428)

I've had it happen a few times, both to myself and to people "on" me

I've seen it happen from the sidelines quite a bit too, so you've been lucky lol!

When you touch someones back tyres with your nose cone it just seems to flick your front in the air and you end up riding their bumper which looks good in photos lol (doesnt really, makes you look like a cock!) But if you do it fast enough you can go flying through the air.

I always find that when I touch someones back tyres with my fronts it just pulls the wheel out your hands. Which if your quick enough reaction wise is redeemable. If your not though you can end up 90-degree sideways and barrel rolling, which is not uncommon!

When karts touch side by side it normally does not a lot, but just sometimes it can send either kart flying, depending on how they touch. I remember seeing this guy ontop of his kart (not in it) with his kart spinning round like a top underneath him, think that's how he managed it!

When people spin I kind of try to go to the inside, but sometimes **** up and get taken out myself

speedy king · 8 Dec 2004, 20:03 (Ref:1174668)

Thats kind of what i expected when i started racing. I've touched rear wheels side on with my fronts and my kart has darted off very sharply towards the side of the track but have managed to control it. Another time though 3 karts tried to go down the straight together and the one who ended up in the middle had no room at all and really shouldn't have gone for the gap. All three were interlocking wheels at one time, just climbing over each other and the kart in the middle bumping up in the air, then a few seconds later the poor guy in the inside of the track in his new kart he'd just bought lost the rear, darted round in to a 180, tyre smoke everywhere and went across the lot of them sideways and took out the guy on the otherside!! The one in the middle who started it got away! He this year though has written 2 chassis' off though apparently and last time i saw him he was on cruches....

Ever find there are some people that could do 100mph in to someones rear wheel and still get away with it!?!?

shiny side up! · 8 Dec 2004, 20:35 (Ref:1174705)

I've ended up on my head a few times, always due to running up over someone's tire from behind. Side-to-side wheel banging can get you in trouble, but doesn't usually send you skyward...

In the early 90s, nose cones weren't allowed in the classes I raced here in the US, and flipping occurred much more frequently, especially at the start. In the mid 90s when noses became legal, the driving standard changed quite a bit, and the types of contact and conduct in traffic were much more agressive due to the fact it was harder to tangle wheels and flip.

speedy king · 8 Dec 2004, 20:39 (Ref:1174711)

How bout if you greased the outside of your tyres on the edge where they stick out the most and dont make contact with the track

Then if you collided side to side the rubber wouldnt grip so much against each other

Mackmot · 8 Dec 2004, 20:44 (Ref:1174714)

The grease would make you spin as it spreads toward the outside of the tyre. Dont do it.

hgmonaro · 9 Dec 2004, 01:12 (Ref:1174901)

yes, I once saw a kart with grease all over the sprocket down to the axle... when quizzed the driver said it was so it would creep up during the race to lubricute the chain. Good in theory.. in practice it would have been throw off by the time he got to the 1st corner on the warm up lap! Every now and then the club would caution against people using grease (marine grease was popular) as it got on the track... I reckon this guy was the culprit!

toot toot · 9 Dec 2004, 11:25 (Ref:1175164)

Quote:

Originally Posted by speedy king

Ever find there are some people that could do 100mph in to someones rear wheel and still get away with it!?!?

It takes a lot of hard work dedication and practice.

Karting_jenny · 10 Dec 2004, 11:44 (Ref:1176060)

When i was a novice which was back in 2000 ish. I had one accident where came around the cornet and the guy behind me came flying over my right shoulder. I didn't what happened (obviously) but he must of hit my back tyre of hit with such force that he launched himself over me.

Anyway at last months meeting at Kimbolton, this was during sat practice and the championship leader came past me and as he past me he was slow out of the corner and i tagged him with my nose cone and to prove this theory i never lost it or flipped.

BillyT · 10 Dec 2004, 21:38 (Ref:1176574)

Fliping over is very dangerous http://www.berrymotorsport.com/share...312//video.wmv

but i think most of the time you can get away with banging wheels just aslong as your careful where and when you do it.

Karting_jenny · 11 Dec 2004, 17:16 (Ref:1177122)

Also gotta look out for lose wheels etc...and maybe a body.

Gore · 13 Dec 2004, 13:11 (Ref:1178206)

Quote:

Originally Posted by btracer

Fliping over is very dangerous http://www.berrymotorsport.com/share...312//video.wmv

That's a clip from a Club100 event. I wasn't at the race, but apparently the guy that ended up on his head took the restart and finished tenth. Not sure I'd have got back in a kart that quickly myself...

BillyT · 13 Dec 2004, 20:55 (Ref:1178657)

Gore what class do you race at club100?

Gore · 14 Dec 2004, 10:31 (Ref:1179053)

btracer: I did the City Challenge series this year, which is a fairly low standard, and one round of the Premier championship, which felt a bit more like real motor racing.

Do you race C100?

PS - you should have received an e-mail from me through 10/10ths; let me know if it hasn't worked.

BillyT · 14 Dec 2004, 20:59 (Ref:1179499)

Hopefully next year i will be racing the sprint series.

The city challenge thats endurance isnt it?

Alex Hodgkinson · 14 Dec 2004, 21:17 (Ref:1179519)

Club 100 is arrive and drive isn't it?

TomS · 14 Dec 2004, 21:44 (Ref:1179548)

Mmmmhm sure is. Enduro and Sprint Championship. Check out www.club100.co.uk

Alex Hodgkinson · 14 Dec 2004, 22:00 (Ref:1179563)

Ahh ok. I've heard of it, obviously, but never knew anything about it because I hadnt looked into it.

BillyT · 15 Dec 2004, 19:08 (Ref:1180441)

Yeah club100 is arrive and drive but its a bit more professional then your average.

speedy king · 18 Dec 2004, 16:05 (Ref:1182617)

£1200 for the full season though i think? I had considered it however you need to be 17 years of age. Know of several people that race in it though and they thoroughly enjoy it

BillyT · 18 Dec 2004, 16:29 (Ref:1182627)

Actually you have to be 16. Luck for me then.

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Modified Physics for Spirit of Speed 1937	MrLipid	Virtual Racers	3	26 Nov 2004 20:48
Track Physics in GPL	gttouring	Virtual Racers	11	12 Feb 2004 13:18
Quantum Physics- or Where Are My Electrons Going?	Bluebottle	Road Car Forum	13	21 Oct 2003 19:54
Er, odd thought concerning wheels...or rather, the amount of wheels...	pirenzo	Sportscar & GT Racing	11	20 Mar 2003 13:14