Miscallany, Etc.

Hazza · 18 Feb 2005, 09:08 (Ref:1229097)

A small useless, but none the less slightly amusing thing I picked up today while browsing the CCWS webpage.

Quote:

www.cart.com
Mario Andretti captured the only Champ Car World Series championship of his illustrious career behind a solid campaign in which he led the series in victories, poles and laps led.

Not that i'm blaiming them for doing the "Nextel Champion" thing, but this leads to my question: What was it called then? PPG Indycar Championship?

macdaddy · 18 Feb 2005, 09:34 (Ref:1229119)

The "PPG Cup" - the ultimate prize of the "PPG IndyCar World Series"?

JohnSSC · 18 Feb 2005, 12:49 (Ref:1229278)

Isn't Revisionist History fun?

Yes it was the PPG IndyCar World Series way back when.

It is always interesting to see how things get turned around by the Series owners. All Winston Cup winners (and champions previous to Winston Cup) have all become "Nextel Champions" in NASCAR.

Our illustrious Three Amigos will patiently explain "we are not CART" when announcing yet another "traditional" venue biting the dust (and having no obligation to that prior iteration of the Series) but are seemingly more than happy to stake their claim on the history of a Series they claim to have little to do with.

And I am just as annoyed at NASCAR doing the same thing with the branding of the Championship, but at least NASCAR is still the same Series - they changed the name of the championship only.

I am still trying to figure out where the "Superspeedway" is that the CC website claims that they race on.

Hazza · 18 Feb 2005, 12:57 (Ref:1229285)

I guess there are different definitions -

Open Wheelers define A speedway as something about 1mile to 1.5 mile long, where as 2 mile speedways like Indy, and Michigan are "Superspeedways" iirc. But isn't LV a cookie cutter - therefore 1.5 not a traditional open wheel super-speedway?

And while we're looking back, what were the Chicagoland races like? I don't actualy remember watching any, I think I missed that race every time it was run by pure freak chance...

luke · 18 Feb 2005, 13:12 (Ref:1229298)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hazza

I guess there are different definitions -

And while we're looking back, what were the Chicagoland races like? I don't actualy remember watching any, I think I missed that race every time it was run by pure freak chance...

Hazza - Do you mean the Chicago Motor Speedway, that was used by Champ Car from '99 to '02?

JohnSSC · 18 Feb 2005, 13:13 (Ref:1229300)

I am probably wrong, but I think 1 - 1.5 mile = an "oval."

Over 1.5 mile and you get into the "superspeedway" territory.

I don't clearly recall the Chicagoland races to be able to comment.

luke · 18 Feb 2005, 13:23 (Ref:1229310)

SMALL OVALS
Ovals between 0.5 Miles and 1.3 Miles in length.

MEDIUM OVALS
Ovals between 1.3 Miles and 2.0 Miles in length.

SUPER SPEEDWAYS
Ovals of 2.0 Miles or above in length.

However, this seems to change around, to be honest I don't think there is a correct definition.

Tenoch · 18 Feb 2005, 17:35 (Ref:1229538)

You dont remember the chicagoland races becuse they never existed, the IRL races there now, CART raced at the chicago motor speedway located in Cicero, aboout 20 feet from Chicago city limits, while the IRL races at Chicagoland outin the suburds about an hour away from the city center,

JohnSSC · 18 Feb 2005, 17:37 (Ref:1229541)

Thanks Tenoch, the one or two remaining brain cells only hold but so much!

Jordi · 19 Feb 2005, 00:31 (Ref:1229847)

I really hate it when they do that. But then again:

1995: PPG IndyCar World Series
1997: PPG CART World Series
1998: FedEx Championship Series
2003: Bridgestone Presents The Champ Car World Series Powered by Ford

While ever since... F1 has been F1. I wish the CART name would be as identifiable as F1 is, but I suppose it was not to be.

Hazza · 19 Feb 2005, 03:00 (Ref:1229889)

Well that's the answer. They weren't at Chicagoland...silly me!

indycool · 21 Feb 2005, 14:04 (Ref:1231432)

Agree on "revisionist history," John SSC.

Regarding Mario, it's interesting that they didn't mention his USAC championships back in the '60s when it was one series previous even to CART and the PPG Cup. He still has the second-highest total of "championship car" (from which the series now takes its name) victories to A.J. Foyt, counting ALL USAC, CART, OWRS and IRL races and both Foyt and Andretti's marks are unlikely to ever be broken.

The term "superspeedway" was originally defined and adopted by NASCAR and the Southern (now National) Motorsport Press Association as ANY track a mile or more in length back in the late '60s when a flood of big tracks (Michigan, Talladega, Pocono, Texas World, Ontario, etc.) were built. The term has become hazy in definition the past 15-20 years as road courses became superspeedways by that definition, etc., so hazy that I don't think anyone agrees on what the term means any more.

JohnSSC · 21 Feb 2005, 14:18 (Ref:1231442)

Good points IC.

Mario did have quite a career during the USAC days (when, arguably one could say it was the most diverse racing series on Earth: Dirt, Asphalt and Bricks!) but the guy who never gets mentioned is AJ Foyt who as you mentioned, holds the overall record. I am no fan of his as a team owner but he is likely the greatest racing car driver this country has produced. Ever.

Winningest open wheel driver, wins in NASCAR, winner at LeMans and also winner at the Daytona 24 Hour (trying to look up confirmation on that one!).

2112 · 21 Feb 2005, 14:40 (Ref:1231458)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jordi

I really hate it when they do that. But then again:

1995: PPG IndyCar World Series
1997: PPG CART World Series
1998: FedEx Championship Series
2003: Bridgestone Presents The Champ Car World Series Powered by Ford

They is many people, I can see at least 2 of those as a direct result of an advisary series after 95.

And I think Mario Andretti accomplishments tops any other American, mainly becuase of the added F1 triumphs, and that Daytona 500 victory.

The Snout · 22 Feb 2005, 02:21 (Ref:1231983)

I figure that since the Amigos are going to be belted either way they might as well have their cake and eat it too. Good luck to them.

BSchneiderFan · 22 Feb 2005, 22:29 (Ref:1232881)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jordi

I really hate it when they do that. But then again:

1995: PPG IndyCar World Series
1997: PPG CART World Series
1998: FedEx Championship Series
2003: Bridgestone Presents The Champ Car World Series Powered by Ford

While ever since... F1 has been F1. I wish the CART name would be as identifiable as F1 is, but I suppose it was not to be.

Well, not quite. Grand Prix racing has always been Grand Prix racing, but in the mid-50s Grand Prix cars ran to F2 regulations, so I think they were officially not Formula 1. But I take your point.

The Snout · 23 Feb 2005, 03:14 (Ref:1233041)

Pre 1950/war they also had the European Championship which was the big Grand Prix prize. Modern F1 basically traces it's origins all the way back to the likes of Renault Brothers Louis and Marcel in France in the early 20th Century racing in the first Grand Prix. Now, "business wise", can Bernie and gang claim that history for Grand Prix ? Probably not. But I and most others sure consider it all part of the same racing heritage no matter who owned it.