Negotiations Jos-Jordan have ended without agreement

[GP Racer]

Minardi must be thrilled with the mess over at Jordan, they may finally be seeing a team they can beat.

Minardi is looking very well put together, almost Ferrari-like, compared to the floundering Jordan.

[FIRE]

Originally posted by Testure
Not so - Jos has negotiated with every team that has a race seat available this year: Jaguar, Jordan and Minardi. The big mistake was dismissing Minardi when he didn't have any guarantee of a seat at Jordan.

Verstappen said at the end of last season he would NOT drive for Minardi in 2004.

[Duffacus]

Jos looks like he won't be in F1 anymore, hmmm, I'm sure there’s a certain Dutch team in sports cars run by a certain Jan Lammers with whom Jos would be a good addition and a great bankroll

[FIRE]

Originally posted by Duffacus
Jos looks like he won't be in F1 anymore, hmmm, I'm sure there’s a certain Dutch team in sports cars run by a certain Jan Lammers with whom Jos would be a good addition and a great bankroll

With only 10% of Verstappen's sponsor budget Jan Lammers/Racing for Holland would be very happy. But I think he will have a sabbatical from racing. Hope he will do DTM in 2005.

[ralf fan]

so what about Jordon? i mean they needed the cash... i just hope it doesnt result in another team folding up!

[Testure]

Originally posted by GP Racer
Minardi must be thrilled with the mess over at Jordan, they may finally be seeing a team they can beat.

Jordan aren't looking good, no, but they're still a more capable outfit than Minardi. They have their own windtunnel, a not-tiny design department and are able to perform testing once in a while. Having sacked a bunch of people in 2002, don't they still employ over 200 people?

[Kicking-back]

Lets hope this paves the way for Allan McNish to get a race seat at Jordan.

He sounded reasonably confident when he appeared on ITV's World Rally programme at the weekend.

[steve nielsen]

Jos and the sponsors have ended negotiations because Jordan could'nt give the guarantee they could finish the season, the could'nt even guarantee they would make it past the first 3 GP's.

[ralf fan]

well that sounds bad....for F1 as a whole... we need more teams not lose more teams

[FIRE]

Originally posted by Kicking-back
Lets hope this paves the way for Allan McNish to get a race seat at Jordan.

He sounded reasonably confident when he appeared on ITV's World Rally programme at the weekend.

He's always confident.

[Bridget Stone]

Originally posted by steve nielsen
Jos and the sponsors have ended negotiations because Jordan could'nt give the guarantee they could finish the season, the could'nt even guarantee they would make it past the first 3 GP's.

If thats the case Steve,( can you give us a source for your claim? ) , Jos and his team were very wise to break of negotiations !
I dont see anybody in his right mind can agree to such propositions.

love , bridget

[steve nielsen]

www.rtlgrandprix.nl

[Kicking-back]

I think it's very dangerous for posters on here to make allegations about a team's financial situation.

What proof do you have about what you claim, Steve Nielsen?

If you don't have proof then it's libellous - and rumours on websites can end up spiralling into a whole lot of problems.

[Bridget Stone]

Originally posted by steve nielsen
www.rtlgrandprix.nl

Thanks very much Steve, pity for the other members that its in Dutch, but maybe the other newssites will pick it up.
So Jordan is driving through financially very dire straits if they cant even guarantee finishing the season. Pity for Jos, but i can understand if he doesn't wanna be part of another formula -1 team going down (like Arrows, Simtek and so forth)

love, Bridget

[steve nielsen]

If you can put 1 and 1 together you can see that Jordan are in deep ****, even Minardi have 2 drivers for 2004, Jordan have none, there must be a reason for that.

EDIT: Autocensor failed

[NiceGuyEddie]

Those are all Dutch sources. The site Steve mentions already suggests that Verstappen could be in line to replace Klien if he fails and that the same could happen with Massa at Sauber, because Jos supposedly was in line to replace Massa in 2002. Well, actually, he wasn't. Peter Sauber informed as to wether or not Jos would be available as a spare-driver (not even a testdriver, because the racedriver at Sauber perform the tests). Jos was available, but didn't fit in the car and the whole thing fell through. If Sauber was really interested, there would be a way to get in a deal with Jos for 2003, but Sauber and Jos were never seriously linked again.

As for now, it is hardly imaginable that Jaguar would even think of replacing Klien with Verstappen, even if Christian doesn't deliver.

[Kicking-back]

Alternatively, it could be that Jordan know the new car will be ready in a couple of weeks, so they can wait until then to sign drivers - ensuring they get the best possible balance between funding and talent.

[NiceGuyEddie]

Originally posted by Bridget Stone
Thanks very much Steve, pity for the other members that its in Dutch, but maybe the other newssites will pick it up.
So Jordan is driving through financially very dire straits if they cant even guarantee finishing the season. Pity for Jos, but i can understand if he doesn't wanna be part of another formula -1 team going down (like Arrows, Simtek and so forth)

love, Bridget

Don't be so naieve. Again, this is a Dutch source and they have been known to be less than careful with their factchecking. It comes as a surprise that only at the end of January Trust manages to get a decent picture of Jordan's financial situations. Perridon only last saturday went public saying that a deal will be done on tuesday (today). How in the world is it possible that Perridon is on the verge of doing a deal, yet a mere three days later runs of because Jordan supposedly can't give him any guarentee. Makes no sense at all and the only part not making sense during these negotiations, were the ones that represented Verstappen.

Of course Jordan needs the money, and if B&H fail to confirm their support for the team for 2004 (which still needs to be done) and no other paydriver comes in the picture, it is going to be hazardous, but Trust should've realize that sooner than they did.

Eddie is probably still busy selling space on the car and apperantly Trust wanted more than their offer justified. Again, all this time it was Eddie who seemed to be unwilling to come to a deal. Trust declared only three days ago that the deal was done as far as they were concerned. so, of course Trust is not the one that decided to run away from it. The smart money says: Eddie showed Michel, Raymond (and therefor Jos) the door.

[NiceGuyEddie]

Originally posted by Kicking-back
Alternatively, it could be that Jordan know the new car will be ready in a couple of weeks, so they can wait until then to sign drivers - ensuring they get the best possible balance between funding and talent.

Jordan wants Heidfeld bad. There still is a provisional contract and the deal can be fulfilled when Jordan reaches a budget in which they can afford themselves to run Heidfeld. So logically Eddie is holding out on finalizing anything before he is sure that he can or cannot hire Heidfeld. Apperantly, the Jos-people were fed up in this waiting game. This comes as no surprise because Trust have said they wanted a deal with Jos finalized during November (still hoping for Jaguar) because their PR-business for the 2004 needed to be setup. Jaguar fell through and they started to run out of time. Then Perridon told the press he wanted a deal done before christmas. Again a no go, even less time remains. Nearing the end of January, Perridon got really nervous. He threw not one, but two ultimata at Eddie Jordan, threatinging to walk away from it all when no deal would follow. No deal followed, yet Eddie apperantly contacted Perridon saying he was very much prepared to sign with Trust (and therefor Jos) but under his conditions. Today, talks resumed and Trust wasn't gaining anymore time, yet Jordan wants to hold out in order to get the most out of it. Pure powerplay which Perridon eventually lost (and had to loose). This is certainly not ideal for Eddie either. Both parties wanted the world and seemed unwilling to conceit to anything. At the end though, Perridon is only a buyer and when Eddie doesn't want to sell, a deal is out of the question.

I believe McNish will be fairly safe for 2004. Heidfeld is still a big question mark. The possibilty remains that Heidfeld isn't affordable, so another paydriver needs to be hooked. Can be everyone.

[Bridget Stone]

Originally posted by NiceGuyEddie
Don't be so naieve. Again, this is a Dutch source and they have been known to be less than careful with their factchecking. It comes as a surprise that only at the end of January Trust manages to get a decent picture of Jordan's financial situations. Perridon only last saturday went public saying that a deal will be done on tuesday (today). How in the world is it possible that Perridon is on the verge of doing a deal, yet a mere three days later runs of because Jordan supposedly can't give him any guarentee. Makes no sense at all and the only part not making sense during these negotiations, were the ones that represented Verstappen.

Of course Jordan needs the money, and if B&H fail to confirm their support for the team for 2004 (which still needs to be done) and no other paydriver comes in the picture, it is going to be hazardous, but Trust should've realize that sooner than they did.

Eddie is probably still busy selling space on the car and apperantly Trust wanted more than their offer justified. Again, all this time it was Eddie who seemed to be unwilling to come to a deal. Trust declared only three days ago that the deal was done as far as they were concerned. so, of course Trust is not the one that decided to run away from it. The smart money says: Eddie showed Michel, Raymond (and therefor Jos) the door.

Mr Nice Guy Eddie, do you have some sort
of Jos-alert sms-service on your mobile phone ? With all due respect, you do look a bit like a Pavlov dog who jumps up every time he reads the words Jos or Verstappen. It looks you're on a sort of
"get rid of this Verstappenguy, doesn't matter how" - campaign.
We are just fans of him, nothing manical about it. I wonder what Jos did what makes you act so neurotic

nevertheless, love and respect from me, bridget

[Kicking-back]

I agree. It's more likely Jordan said no to Jos and co than vice-versa. Allegations about Jordan being on the verge of collapse come from Dutchmen bitter that their man's grand prix career is over.

[Dutch chap]

I don’t trust (funny word nowadays) the Dutch sources either. I have this feeling that Mr. Perridon (CEO Trust) had a sponsor deal with EJ and that was what he was talking about last Friday. It all depended on what Jos had to say about it. At that moment Huub Rothengatter came in the picture again, working for Jos as his personal manager. If EJ was not willing to give Jos a no 1 status, or at least a joined no 1 status, within the Jordan outfit it just didn’t seem a good deal. It’s better to be in the no 1 seat at Jordan than the no 2 seat at Jaguar but who wants to have the no 2 seat at Jordan? If that was EJ’s offer, after bringing millions (how many we don’t really know, but is must be a lot) I think it was a good decision to say no to it. I wouldn’t be surprised if Jos will get this (no 1) seat after all. If not, better go to the US and be a front runner on about 25% of the same sponsor budget (if there is a market for Trust in the US).

[NiceGuyEddie]

Originally posted by Bridget Stone
Mr Nice Guy Eddie, do you have some sort
of Jos-alert sms-service on your mobile phone ? With all due respect, you do look a bit like a Pavlov dog who jumps up every time he reads the words Jos or Verstappen. It looks you're on a sort of
"get rid of this Verstappenguy, doesn't matter how" - campaign.
We are just fans of him, nothing manical about it. I wonder what Jos did what makes you act so neurotic

nevertheless, love and respect from me, bridget

Well, this topic existed for quite a while before I decided to step in. I believe Verstappen is overrated and all in all an unpleasant guy (I only know what I see on TV), but if you insist on being a fan, than thats fine with me. The point is that this is about the facts and the assumptions that can be based upon it and I feel it's just a little to easy to assume that Trust decided against a deal and not Jordan.

Love and respect!
Mr. NGE

(you may even call me NiceGuyEddieJordan )

[Arnoldus]

Wasn't Heidfeld the guy who said he'd drive for free?

Now that's what I call begging!

[Adam43]

or being realistic.