Driver Button vs Hamilton

dsg · 15 Mar 2010, 02:22 (Ref:2652326)

With heavy fuel loads requiring drivers to look after their tyres I expect the advantage in races should go to the smoother driver style of Bu....

Oh.

**Born Racer** · 15 Mar 2010, 02:25 (Ref:2652329)

I think Hamilton will have more than just the edge over Button quite a lot this season.

Hamilton will beat Button the majority of the time, but there will be days where Button shows the way. I don't expect that much though.

I think Hamilton can learn (and is maybe already demonstrating it) how to conserve tyres. Learning how to be a naturally quicker driver is something different though. Button will struggle to do that.

Knowlesy · 15 Mar 2010, 11:19 (Ref:2652531)

It's not like Lewis ever destroyed his tires disproportionately anyways. In fact, Heikki was harder on tyres than Lewis was when they were together.

Obviously Button is something else on the tyre front, but he just isn't as outright quick as Hamilton. It's all very well having tyres in perfect nick at 75% distance, but no use if you're twenty seconds back down the road.

There will be days when Jenson wins the battle, but he won't get close to winning the war.

jab · 15 Mar 2010, 11:24 (Ref:2652533)

Oh what a surprise, Lewis can adapt his driving style. Never would've bet on that happening

craigd · 15 Mar 2010, 11:51 (Ref:2652550)

Quote:

Originally Posted by dsg

With heavy fuel loads requiring drivers to look after their tyres I expect the advantage in races should go to the smoother driver style of Bu....

Oh.

The problem is that conserving tyres isn't actually that important, since everyone is forced to do mimic each other and pit at the same time. Also the tyres are too conservative.

Button said how he felt he could have gone longer (as I'm sure others could on the softs too), but the constrained rules don't allow a tortoise vs the hare approach to racing.

This isn't a defence of Button by the way - Hamilton gave the better performance as you would expect. But until the rules are made more flexible (i.e. let the teams pit however mnay times they want - including not at all - and let them use any tyres they wish, but still start on qualifying tyres), then you're not going to get drivers trying out different strategies and playing to their supposed strengths.

Ralf's Girl · 15 Mar 2010, 21:29 (Ref:2652998)

My dad has bet me a bottle of wine that Button will score more points than Hamilton this season. I'm trying to decide whether I want a riesling or a sauvignon.

Super Hans · 15 Mar 2010, 22:05 (Ref:2653027)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ralf's Girl

My dad has bet me a bottle of wine that Button will score more points than Hamilton this season.

Betting with family members can be fraught with danger. My daughter, who is three, told me on saturday evening that the Ferraris were going to win. 'Ah, bless' I though, expecting a Vettel walkover.

SSbaby · 16 Mar 2010, 03:41 (Ref:2653198)

I think this comparison is more interesting than the Vettel vs Webber thread.

Personally, I can't stand Hamilton. I never thought he was actually as good as Alonso... However, it will be interesting to see how Button performs against his British rival. I thought the two were about even as far as speed and talent is concerned.

Will be good to watch the results unfold, this season.

OZ_HCR32 · 16 Mar 2010, 05:37 (Ref:2653231)

It seems the team arent going to give him half a season to find his feet...

http://www.planetf1.com/news/18227/6...en-Jense-Lewis

**Peter Mallett** · 16 Mar 2010, 09:03 (Ref:2653306)

Um,

Nick Fry is still with Merc isn't he?

Haven't seen qualifying or the race but this one's a clear win for Lewis. Unsurprising really, not many WDC's go to another team and put in a good defence of the championship. The last one to do it was (IIRC) Fittipaldi.

Tim the Grey · 16 Mar 2010, 17:25 (Ref:2653614)

Lewis won the battle, he hasn't won the war. Yet.

Marbot · 16 Mar 2010, 18:30 (Ref:2653657)

Andrew Benson BBC.

"An instructive little moment unfolded in the final qualifying session, when the wind direction suddenly changed 90 degrees from how it had been in the previous session just a few minutes before.

Not knowing this, Button suddenly felt the car "go strange" through one of the corners of the middle sector. Assuming there was a technical problem with the car, he was somewhat cautious for the rest of the lap, braking early, taking less speed into the corners."

No wonder he was surprised to get 8th!

Anyway, I'm not supposed to be here. Bye!

jab · 16 Mar 2010, 22:09 (Ref:2653782)

He complained about "problems" in qualifying last year when he didn't do a decent job...

**Adam43** · 16 Mar 2010, 22:15 (Ref:2653785)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Unsurprising really, not many WDC's go to another team and put in a good defence of the championship. The last one to do it was (IIRC) Fittipaldi.

Emmo was '72 and '74 so there was a gap. Prost was close in '90, Alonso too in 2008. Only close though.

So that will be just the once, with Fangio! And he was at it all the time

jab · 16 Mar 2010, 22:44 (Ref:2653817)

Fangio's skill was at picking the right car. He only ever signed one year contracts so that he could jump ship to whoever had the best car. It's allegedly why he quit in 1958 when the Maserati was clearly subordinate to the Vanwall and the Ferrari

**Peter Mallett** · 17 Mar 2010, 02:27 (Ref:2653907)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adam43

Emmo was '72 and '74 so there was a gap. Prost was close in '90, Alonso too in 2008. Only close though.

So that will be just the once, with Fangio! And he was at it all the time

TY.

RT · 22 Mar 2010, 15:02 (Ref:2657850)

Hamilton clearly had more pace and also he is totally familiar with all aspects of the McLaren team, including the support (or bias, depending on your view) of Ron Dennis. Jenson, on the other hand will have to get used to the team and clearly has to gain a measure of impartiality from Dennis. All in all, Jense is on a new playing field and ...... its not level!! However, Jenson is pretty cool under pressure and not, he is not slow plus he has one huge advantage in that he very very rarely makes mistakes. He's probably the most mistake-free driver in the grid.

**Born Racer** · 22 Mar 2010, 17:22 (Ref:2657945)

Ron Dennis isn't involved in the day-to-day running of the race team, or even much involved with the race team at all.

Knowlesy · 22 Mar 2010, 17:46 (Ref:2657963)

Quote:

Originally Posted by RT

Hamilton clearly had more pace and also he is totally familiar with all aspects of the McLaren team, including the support (or bias, depending on your view) of Ron Dennis.

If you're gonna pedal a conspiracy theory at least check some facts!

Andy Harrison · 22 Mar 2010, 17:57 (Ref:2657971)

I think Jenson will show more progress with the MP4-25 at Albert Park compared to his pace at Bahrain, but overall he will still be off the pace of Lewis.
I don't see Jenson's 'smooth driving style' beating the raw talent of Hamilton in any Grand Prix. But as long as it's a better race on Saturday than a fortnight ago, who cares if it's Hamilton or Button!

Cool Hamilton 2010 profile vid:
http://www.grid1.tv/videos/featured/...2010-interview

Mr V · 22 Mar 2010, 19:56 (Ref:2658069)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Knowlesy

If you're gonna pedal a conspiracy theory at least check some facts!

Where's the fun in that

JamesH · 23 Mar 2010, 08:48 (Ref:2658433)

Quote:

Originally Posted by jab

He complained about "problems" in qualifying last year when he didn't do a decent job...

If you are in a car that suddenly starts to behave differently and feels a bit odd, for no reasons you are aware off, do you keep driving as fast as you can? Or back of slightly just in case something falls off?

"He who fights and runs away, lives to fight another day" etc etc

jab · 23 Mar 2010, 13:54 (Ref:2658598)

The only "problems" Button has in qualifying is a lack of talent when the car isn't exactly 100% perfect

RT · 23 Mar 2010, 14:55 (Ref:2658632)

I'm not starting a conspiracy about who gets better treatment at Mclaren. The point is that Hamilton is completely familiar with the ways of the team and Jenson isn't. And about Ron..... OK, OK, he's not in the same role as before but to say that he is not hugely influential in the team is like sayng that Enzo Ferrari was not influential throughout all operations of Ferrari in his day. If Ron talks, everybody there will listen at McLaren and he has shown a clear fondness for the Hamster. Actively or passively, his influence will still be there, it would be naive to think otherwise. Jense does have a steep hill to climb there.

**Peter Mallett** · 23 Mar 2010, 15:39 (Ref:2658654)

Anybody who has moved jobs will know that the incumbents will have a group (clique if you will) that can influence the way the team works. I experience it on every new job I go to. I would think that Button knows this and will realise that the team is looking at him for a solid performance and feedback rather than taking Lewis to the wire. The point may be that Lewis is top gun this year and Button will be running in support. Next year, once he is established he'll be able to dictate his own terms, then they and we can decide whether he is really that good. FWIW I believe he is that good but different to Lewis.

As a contrast we could compare other teams such as Red Bull f'rinstance. The established driver there has been pretty well overshadowed by the new boy, but then again, so far neither of them is a WDC.

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