2003 dissapointments

Knowlesy · 29 May 2003, 21:41 (Ref:614131)

The year 2003 promised so much for some of the teams and has delivered so little.....

Minardi pulled off something of a coup by getting Cossie engines. They were expected to garner some points and battle with the midfield. So far? Nowt!

Toyota. Superb engine, woeful chassis last year. This year they came up with an F2002 copy. So why are they in the middle to lower reaches of the grid?

Jordan also got cossies and there were high hopes for the nimble looking EJ13. Granted, they got a fluke win. But it was a fluke. Performance has fell hort of expectations....

Williams. BMW grunt and another sound looking car. Has turned out to be even worse than last year, though development is rapid.

Sauber. Looking for fourth place. Aerodynamic deficiencies putting paid to that.

So who have been the biggest dissapointments of 2003? Also, what about drivers (step forward Pizzonia, Villeneuve etc...).

Air your views.

NiceGuyEddie · 29 May 2003, 22:00 (Ref:614145)

Big dissapointment has to be Williams. Should've been up there, but their not. In stead, they are being chased by Renault and on a bad day even by B*A*R.

Minardi seems to be ok. Everyone who expected more from the Minardi/Cosworth-package, just needs a realitycheck. And they've got one.

Sauber is obviously suffering from a designflaw and Heidfeld even more then Frentzen. A big dissapointment for sure, because Heidfeld needs some performance to get his career going. At this is not working out for him at all. Frentzen probably couldn't care less. DTM in 2004 for him.

Villeneuve is somewhat dissapointing after badmouthing Button without having run at all. Serves him well.

Pizzonia is, I'll admit, awful at times. Pre-season I really expected him to destroy Webber, but it's vice versa. I cannot understand how a driver who managed to impress both sir Frank Williams and Patrick Head and even set the quickest time for Jag at Barca during his first outing for the team in 2002, underperformes in the manor he does. He is quick, but not when it matters.

Toyota is seemingly on a five year-plan, but with this pace, it'll be a decade or two before they can start about thinking about gunning for the championship.

NiceGuyEddie · 29 May 2003, 22:02 (Ref:614146)

BTW, Jordan ain't that bad. Pre-season they were one of two teams with severe financial problems, and they still are. But they manage to compete rather effectivly, at least when Fisichella is at the wheel. Although Firman deserves some credit on raceday. In Malaysia he was good and at Austria, for example, he was able to match Fisico's pace.

JonesF1 · 29 May 2003, 22:57 (Ref:614191)

Everyone knew Williams would be in trouble once McLaren got their act together but I dont think anyone knew it would be this bad. Very disappointing so far.

DNQ · 29 May 2003, 23:04 (Ref:614192)

Toyota and Williams. For Sure. I didn't expect much from the 'privateer' teams.

Lee Janotta · 29 May 2003, 23:07 (Ref:614194)

Williams is an emotional dissapointment, sure. But Toyota should be ashamed of themselves, running as far back as they are, with their budget and their engine (as well as a GP winner and a CART champion in the seats).

Logrence · 30 May 2003, 01:16 (Ref:614246)

I was expecting all the others, but Sauber is the one I'm most disappointed with...I don't know where it went wrong - at least within the next couple of years they'll have this new wind tunnel business...

Schummy · 30 May 2003, 02:54 (Ref:614290)

Williams because we all expect it could be there in the top with Ferr and Macs, and now they are fighting to be fourth.

On other side, Jordan because without that relatively lucky win of Fisi, they would be really in bad position. Some times they looks second or third last on pace =:-o

DNQ · 30 May 2003, 06:48 (Ref:614387)

Logrence, Sauber haven't really got worse since 2001, it's just everyone has made gigantic leaps. In 2001, Jaguar, BAR and Benetton were nowhere, now they've made leaps and bounds, and with the arrival of Toyota, it's hard for them to keep up with the powerhouse teams like Ferrari and Mclaren.

pb btcc · 30 May 2003, 06:59 (Ref:614395)

I say williams as there haven't been on the pace most of the season.

golem · 30 May 2003, 07:02 (Ref:614399)

Toyota. They have the resources, they have some decent staff and good facilities. Form to date has shown promise at times but woeful lately.

Damon · 30 May 2003, 07:10 (Ref:614408)

Williams, they promised so much with the new car in the off season but it has failed to deliver big time.

MrSal · 30 May 2003, 07:23 (Ref:614426)

Williams could have won a couple of races with reliability, but this may have been due to Montoya's driving than the car.
Toyota-too many changes in the team in a short space of time, both with drivers and tecvhnical staff.
Jordan- total fluke win. Unreliability problems and disappointing speed. Must be due to lack of testing.
Sauber-Probably about where they should be given the size and structure of the team.
Controversial one here. Ferrari. Is the new car any improvement on last years one? I know it had a huge act to follow but I'm not sure it is. TGF will still win championship because he never breaks down and the McLaren will do.

Glen · 30 May 2003, 09:25 (Ref:614515)

The Ferrari? Don't worry about that - they haven't used the top three gears yet!

Sauber are no-where, despite many people enthusing about the engine and (wrongly) the rear end being Ferrari.

Toyota is a huge waste of money at the moment, but they are doing a very good job of proving the folly of the idea of going it alone to BMW.

Williams are not that bad - Montoya at least can drive that car, as I'm sure we'll see tomorrow.

Toyota are the big losers.

Logrence · 30 May 2003, 10:09 (Ref:614545)

I don't think Toyota are doing that badly at all considering they're only in their 3rd year since starting the programme from scratch.

I think people have completely unrealistic expectations of them - yes, so they have lots of money, but at the end of the day, the team is only run by humans...

Knowlesy · 30 May 2003, 10:11 (Ref:614550)

Did you watch quali' yesterday? Toyota were woeful! They really should do better. I'm not saying they should be challenging for wins but they should be gunning for points and in a position to capitalize should the frontrunners fall off, and get a fortuitous podium. They are simply performing UNACCEPTABLY.

30 May 2003, 10:31 (Ref:614574)

I Agree knowlesy, Toyota are seriously underperfoming this year. I just feel sorry for Panis and Da Matta, its obviously the car that is slow, not the drivers.

Knowlesy · 30 May 2003, 10:43 (Ref:614585)

It has to be the car, TTT, because Panis and Da Matta are very capable drivers aren't they? I've heard Toyota are trying to sign Mike Gascoyne, but I can't see him moving from a happy team on the up to a political shambles, can you?

30 May 2003, 10:57 (Ref:614601)

Toyota have to do something and they have access to practically unlimited funds, it wouldn't surprise me if they make Gascoyne an offer he can't refuse. Won't make much difference though unless they become a proper racing team and are given more freedom by the corporate bosses. I still can't believe they got rid of Salo and McNish when it was clearly the car that caused the lack of performance last year How long will it be until they have to have a Japanese driver?

krt917 · 30 May 2003, 11:02 (Ref:614606)

Yes, they don't seem to have developed quite the right approach. Continuity of at least one driver might have been helpful!

I can see the argument for Williams, but they have at least had the odd decent moment and we knew they were having problems with the car as soon as it started testing, whereas the Toyota SEEMED quite good before the season started. Unfortunately, what they actually seem to have is a not particularly quick car that is rather unreliable.

f1manoz · 30 May 2003, 12:31 (Ref:614680)

Sauber. Horrible, horrible little car that is affecting poor Nick to the enth degree. He just can't win.

That's the problem by being a small team going up against the big guns. Slowly they will slide back...

**Bononi** · 30 May 2003, 12:54 (Ref:614707)

Williams no doubt ! A great engine, I think BMW is taking too long to go back to the top.

Sauber comes in second. But after getting HHF to drive for them, I didn't expect any step further...

bradenc · 30 May 2003, 14:26 (Ref:614797)

Minardi started this year with the same engine jag started 2002 with. So it wouldn't be fair to say they've dissapointed because their cossie is differant to that of EJ's and Jags.

Williams is the big dissapointment one of if not the most powerful engines, and a heritage of building superb motor cars and nowt from them.

JV has also disspointed after all the winter talk, I was looking forward to a close thing with JB and JV.

jetsetter · 30 May 2003, 14:30 (Ref:614802)

Toyota is my dissapointment of the season, they have been nothing short of pathetic this season. Surely a review is needed at the end of the season to clean out the deadwood in the team.

Mr V · 30 May 2003, 16:28 (Ref:614949)

Quote:

Originally posted by MrSal
Williams could have won a couple of races with reliability, but this may have been due to Montoya's driving than the car.

:confused: ??? Montoya's 2nd place at OZ is the teams best result of the season. (obviously could have been a win, but still the best result) and reliability at Austria had nothing to do with the driver.

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View Poll Results: Who has been the biggest dissapointment this year?
Minardi	2	3.39%
Toyota	12	20.34%
Jordan	3	5.08%
Williams	30	50.85%
Sauber	12	20.34%
Voters: 59. You may not vote on this poll