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11 Jun 2004, 09:54 (Ref:1000585) | #1 | ||
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Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,117
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Tickets at MSV circuits
Now the dust is settling from the first week of the new rules, I have found:
1. Circuit staff and managers are being sensible about the new instructions. 2. Just in case, you should always take the mobile number of the Chief with you. 3. After our Cadwell meeting last weekend, I have been asked to provide no of marshals attending and copies of sign on sheets to MSV. Even more work and, I, too, am a volunteer! 4. I guess someone at MSV has the chore of repeating all my work scanning the sign on sheets to make sure I am honest. Presumably they will be paid. This should cost marginally more than the cost of, what I think, is VERY limited abuse. What they need at MSV is less administators and more businessmen. Rant over!!! |
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11 Jun 2004, 09:59 (Ref:1000589) | #2 | ||
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Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,117
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As we also have to return all unused tickets for counting it will help if:
- if you can't come, please send back tickets via post or someone who is coming. - Give back any unused guest tickets at sign-on. |
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750MC Chief Marshal - comments made are personal and do not necessarily reflect any club or MSA policy or opinion. |
11 Jun 2004, 11:41 (Ref:1000664) | #3 | ||
Racer
Join Date: Mar 1999
Posts: 344
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All sing along now -
"Oh It all makes work for the working man to do" Just seems to me that MSV is just another organisation run by suits... |
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Instruction to all drivers - Black bit - yours, green bit - ours |
11 Jun 2004, 15:13 (Ref:1000835) | #4 | |||
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Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 383
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Quote:
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I'm not their Father, I'm just the taxi service!!!!!! Its not worth mugging me, my kids beat you to it! Now a Grandad |
11 Jun 2004, 15:35 (Ref:1000853) | #5 | ||
Rookie
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 11
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Remember Parkinsons Law of Admin / Management "The amount of paper work will increase in order to fully utilise the number of shinies (people who sit at desks) available to deal with it"
Is the whole of idea of issuing tickets a ploy by Mr Palmer and his associates to deprive the clubs of marshals thus leaving the way clear for him to offer marshals to the clubs at a price determined by his goodself. This will increase his profits as he will not have to pay for training costs, the BMRMC, BRDC Marshals Club, BARC will gladly train his marshals for him at little cost. |
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11 Jun 2004, 16:59 (Ref:1000912) | #6 | ||
Racer
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 156
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I have no real objection to the use of tickets, we've done it in the past. I can also see the obvious benefits to marshals of using the MSA licence for last minute availability. What I haven't seen is MSV's rationale behind the change. Are hundreds of marshals sneaking in as freebie spectators early on race day morning using their MSA cards? Marshals aren't paying spectators and if the time ever comes when MSV or other circuits attempt to levy a charge on me for my attendance [as it was rumoured a previous incumbent of Brands Hatch Liesure tried to do], then its the end of me marshalling at those circuits.
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Tony Johnston Me a pseudo? Never!:) |
11 Jun 2004, 18:50 (Ref:1001029) | #7 | ||
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Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 664
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I am soon to upgrade from green to red, and it cost me to attend now (fuel/food/time). I am afraid any charge made for me to attend as a volunteer would be the last time I attended a meeting.
It is a big saga if you are available at short notice, trust me I experienced this the other week as did another marshal on the post with me. It is one thing this will do, is put new marshals off and eventually prevent existing marshals from volunteering at short notice. Maybe once a few meetings have to be cancelled things will revert back to normality! |
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Steve - SRPhotography BMMC Member since Oct 2001 Marshalled my first Rally on 9th March 2002 (Malcolm Wilson Rally) Marshalled my first Race on 6th April 2002 (750MC - Oulton Park) Marshalled my first British F1 GP 18th/20th July 2003 |
11 Jun 2004, 19:35 (Ref:1001059) | #8 | ||
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Join Date: May 2002
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I'm confused here if you have to provide copies of signing on sheets, then that must tally with the number of officials signed on. If a chief marshal has been assigned a certaian amount of tickets and the seceratary of the meeting so many for all the other officials is it not a question of adding the two up and seeing if it tallies to the tickets recieved. Why do they need the unused tickets?
I also have concerns that a commercial organisation is going to get my name & address. The signing on sheet is an MSA document i do not believe a copy of it should be given to anybody. |
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11 Jun 2004, 19:50 (Ref:1001078) | #9 | ||
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Join Date: Jan 2002
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good ponit Flagwaver. Does this comply with the Data Protection Act as when these sheets go to MSV whi is responsible for them and how will they be looked after and so no one else gets our details. then its more junk mail.
RS |
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Heartstart courses are for everyone to learn to save a life. |
11 Jun 2004, 20:40 (Ref:1001107) | #10 | ||
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Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 135
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The blood is slowly startin to boil as i read all these new petty rules bout entry to circuits . Most marshals are putting in a 12 - 15 hour day by the time we have travelled to these circuits to work FOR FREE !!! I think they are gettin their workforce pretty cheap , so why cant we sneak in a few times during the season using an MSA card . There has to be a few perks to every job .I am sure the powers that be enjoy a good few ' tax - breaks '
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strange is unique..i am strange therefore i am unique |
11 Jun 2004, 21:27 (Ref:1001146) | #11 | ||
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this mazda59 doesnt mince her words does she
looks like a not person to be crossed and seems to know what shes may be talking about or may be shes a offical undercover lol |
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Cheshire Motor Cycle Marshals Club Doug Austin Marshal Of The Year 2008 and 2009 |
12 Jun 2004, 20:42 (Ref:1002053) | #12 | |||
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Quote:
2. It gives the honest marshals a bad name This is one of the reasons some circuits started issuing tickets to officials and other saying that the wearing of orange didn't give you automatic admission. |
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You win some, lose some, wreck some - Dale Earnhardt |
12 Jun 2004, 21:02 (Ref:1002064) | #13 | |||
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Quote:
Personally I have never found any trouble in getting in without tickets if you are polite and sensible. Example: Last weekend I was a late addition to the marshals for a Superbike meeting as the Rescue crew were short of people. No tickets so went prepared with my chief official's mobile phone number. Made sure that I was wearing overalls before getting to the gate (I don't normally). Spoke to the guy on the gate who said "have a word with my supervisor over there" (or words to that effect. The supervisor looked at my overalls and said "no problem - carry on and tell any of my guys further in that I said OK". That seems reasonable to me and for a high profile and high security meeting at that. Well done Thruxton. Regards Jim |
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Life is not safe, just choose where you want to take the risks. |
13 Jun 2004, 06:42 (Ref:1002339) | #14 | ||
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Join Date: Jun 2004
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I had no problem in gaining access to Oulton Park for Mr Palmers meeting. The very nice security people on the gate were not interested in looking at my ticket, yet other people had to show their tickets. No consistency is worse than hard and rigid application of the rules, nobody knows where they stand or what the procedure is.
As a bye, Mr Palmer did not even acknowledge the marshals in the Officials page of his programme. Just shows his thoughts and attitudes towards us. Motor racing is a team event, break a thread and you will have problems. We all rely on one another to make a successful meeting. Perhaps it is time for the hatchet to be buried and we can all get on with enjoying our great sport. |
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13 Jun 2004, 10:42 (Ref:1002471) | #15 | ||
Racer
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 135
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Dishonest -NO !!!!!!!!!!
I dont think my executives would class themselves dishonest when they are enjoying corporate hospitality at Jackie Stewart centre when our car races !!!!!! And i certainly am not dishonest ( thanx all the same ) Don't tar all marshals with the same brush .Some of us actually joined for the love of the sport & not the 'glory 'of wearing an orange uniform. But back to point - some of us dont know til fridays if we are working on race days so isnt it better to swell the numbers on the day by admission of MSA card . Or if we do use it to gain admision FREE at least we keep up to par with whats gone on for when we don that orange overall again. |
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strange is unique..i am strange therefore i am unique |
13 Jun 2004, 11:27 (Ref:1002494) | #16 | ||
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Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 135
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Re : my remarks -free admission using MSA card etc
before anyone else gets wrong end of the stick I was suggesting sanctioned perks by owners of the track given to marshals as a gesture of thanx & appreciation for hard work we do NOT DISHONESTY !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
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strange is unique..i am strange therefore i am unique |
13 Jun 2004, 15:09 (Ref:1002631) | #17 | |||
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Quote:
we are trying to increase marshals not loose marshals you are the going the right way to deter people away from marshaling mazda has a point and the views should be digested not slagged off |
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13 Jun 2004, 18:43 (Ref:1002773) | #18 | ||
Racer
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 110
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At Oulton last Saturday there was no one even on the gate to check my ticket when I got there! Just a case of driving through unchecked!!
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13 Jun 2004, 19:30 (Ref:1002811) | #19 | ||
Rookie
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 79
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Come to Rockingham!!
Tickets arrive in plenty of time. Special car-park for marshals. No hastle. Great Racing. Short day! and................. Great time had by all!!!!!!!!!!! |
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Now the National Grading Officer for BMMC - contactable on 07 04 05 SIMON |
13 Jun 2004, 20:50 (Ref:1002893) | #20 | |||
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Quote:
The only reason I posted what I did was years ago, when I first started marshalling, there were some marshals who used to volunteer for a meeting, get the tickets, turn up in orange and disappear from sight. They were spectating and it didn't go down very well with the rest of us who turned up to work. Actually Mazda does have a point. If we wanted to spectate at meeting just by way of a change, it would be nice to be given free admission without having to go begging for tickets. Mind you would you really want to spectate? I know I wouldn't. As for me going the right way to deter people from marshalling, would you care to explain exactly how? |
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You win some, lose some, wreck some - Dale Earnhardt |
13 Jun 2004, 23:23 (Ref:1003005) | #21 | ||
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Mazda59. I don't know who you are apart from the fact that you are new to marshalling this year. The one thing I do know is that I do not like the tone you are adopting. Woody says you seem to know what you are talking about; personally I don't think you have a clue.
Marshals are volunteers and give their time for free without any wish for payment or recompense. If a small token is given then it's gratefully received. To take advantage of our position of trust undermines the well-earned reputation marshals have for fairness, professionalism and above all integrity. If we start eroding that, organisers and owners can pretty soon make life uncomfortable for us; us, being those that love the sport and give ourselves to it for the love of it. I believe you are adopting the "eye for an eye" approach that is totally misguided. Just because some clubs are inconsiderate it doesn't mean we can abuse the trust in us to decide to defraud those clubs by fraudulently presently a MSA license / club membership to gain unrightfull access to a meeting. Two + wrongs, do not make a right. Your executives are at that meeting by right of having invitations to attend. If they are receiving hospitality to which they are not entitled that is up to their consciences. It does not give an excuse to anyone else to gain access to the meeting and/or facilities under false pretences. Do you really believe that just because you are a marshal you can attend a meeting for free regardless of whether you are on duty or not?? The crux of this is that OP maintained an unusual entry system to most of British circuits and that has now been changed. Like it or lump it. At most circuits entry is by ticket or pass; not having either at the last minute will not deter the genuine marshal. A quick phone call to the CM, or an explanation to security will produce wonders. Gaining entry via a MSA license/membership card has been curtailed and if that was being used to gain unauthorised entry then its demise was overdue. Rant over, next thread please. |
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Ian Chalmers, Maker of circuit flags. |
14 Jun 2004, 07:24 (Ref:1003166) | #22 | ||
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Well said Chiggers.
Ladies and gents lets calm down a little....PLEASE! |
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The Priest Catcher Honoured recipient of the BARC Browning Medal |
14 Jun 2004, 08:23 (Ref:1003196) | #23 | ||
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There's some posh words in there Ian, where did you learn how to speak like that?
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27 Years In Orange |
14 Jun 2004, 16:39 (Ref:1003760) | #24 | ||
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Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 135
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Before you rant any more chiggers, read the thread properly. Yet another with the wrong end of the stick !
Yes i am new, but novices are entitled to their opinions. Not a bad thing to bring new blood & opinions into the sport. Use your experience to teach new ones not frighten them out of the sport before they have got started |
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strange is unique..i am strange therefore i am unique |
14 Jun 2004, 20:15 (Ref:1003986) | #25 | ||
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Guys, please don'tlet this degenerate into a personal attack. I have the big stick to hand so behave or present yourself in my study with a book down the back of your trousers as protection
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The Priest Catcher Honoured recipient of the BARC Browning Medal |
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