Minardi driver line up

[cds_uk]

As much as i love Minardi i have to say this year has been desperate, we all knew the limitations with the car and especially the engine before the first race but i have to say P S`s choice of drivers struck me as odd back then and so it has proven, Bruni is a competent journeyman at best and Z B is, well what can i say that hasn`t been said 100 times already, this really is one of the weakest driver pairings ever seen in F1. The question is does Stoddy stick with it for the remainder of the year or should he go after a real charger like Liuzzi and try to split the Jordans on occasion, a perfectly acheavable goal and a real boost for morale given the equipment available. As i said at the start i am a real dyed in the wool Minardi fan and it is a real concern, i hope Stoddy can at least get a decent Ford engine for next year and get back to the charger in one car cheque book in the other car formula.

[Dani Filth]

their best chance would be a Ferrari engine . at least he would know those do not go puffff ... drivers are decent .. you can't keep a Webber at Minardi and "Webbers" aren't in that many numbers .. yeah Liuzzi would be a good choice i think .. but only if he can bring some money . Minardi would die without pay-drivers

[Knowlesy]

I couldn't see Minardi splitting the Jordans cds_uk......they seem to be slowly edging forward. The car looks a bit better.

Minardi is going backwards with its car.......it still has 2002 design components.....whoever is put in that car will not move it up the grid. Even TGF!

[Kicking-back]

Ron Dennis recently praised Minardi - and said it would not be possible to race in Formula One with less of a budget than Minardi has.

He also praised Paul Stoddard's "frugal approach".

That is why Minardi needs Baumgartner - his sponsorship helps keep the team going,

And long may it survive.

[Tweed]

Minardi are in a catch-22 situation. They always need at least one paying driver, but can't hold on to future 'stars' for more than one season. IMO, they'll always be treading water, sadly.

[cds_uk]

knowlsey, i fully accept that Minardi will not move up the grid with this car, i just meant that with someone a little quicker than Bruni, (surely not to hard to find) then it was more than possible to get ahead of Pantano who seems to be struggling, and you have to agree that doing that once or twice on pace alone would be a huge filip to the team.

[Dani Filth]

not hard to find . but harder to find someone quicker . and with the same sponsor money . that's the problem ..

[Knowlesy]

Possibly, but it wuldn't really improve their situation at all. Beating Pantano likely means qualifying 20th and finishing 15th. Which oesn't change the situation for Minardi at all in terms of points, in terms of championship position, in terms of money, and therefore in terms of morale.

Which is a shame really.....

[Kicking-back]

Pantano is actually much closer to Heidfeld's pace this weekend. Glock must've been a wake-up call.

[Teretonga]

It would be much better if they could become someones 'B' team eg Toyota or Honda or someone else who could then do a 'cheap' engine deal with decent engines, a manufacturer supported up and coming driver and then get a 'pay' driver who has real ability in the second car (which could then have more potential with the extra $$$) and at least they would be getting the most out of their package. With all respect to their 3 renta drivers I don't think any of them are potential Schumacher's/Alonso's/Kimi's

[Snrub]

The way F1 is going I don't see how they can get out of this hole unless someone better provides them with an engine or Cosworth decides to give them something substantially better than what they give Jordan.

[Spudgun]

Personally, I take my hat off to the guys for being able to survive for so long in a series that is now such a cash drain.

I know it will never happen, but I'd love a manufacturer to team up with them, someone like General Motors. Everything is there, just no cash.

[courageous]

Pound for Pound (£ that is, not lb) Minardi is the best team out there. Recently, they have had a good run of luck in finding drivers (Trulli, Fisichella, Alonso, Webber, Wilson); this year there was really no outstanding rookies with money - in a year or 2 it will be a different matter with a lot of sons of champions coming through the ranks, they should be able to pick somebody up - but again it will still see them well in the bottom half.
Still, the number of teams that have crumbled since Minardi started makes them champions for just surviving.

[Adam43]

Originally posted by courageous
Pound for Pound (£ that is, not lb) Minardi is the best team out there.

That is an interesting point. I'm not sure it is the case.

If you take points scored so far this year and divide by budget:

Million dollars spent to gain one point.

Team             Pts    m$       m$/pt 
Ferrari	         124	303	 2.4
Renault	          61	257	 4.2
BAR-Honda	  52	222	 4.3
Williams-BMW	  36	230	 6.4
Sauber-Petronas	  15	115	 7.7
McLaren-Mercedes  12	269	22.4
Jordan-Ford	   5	 60	12.0
Toyota	           4	287	71.8
Jaguar-Cosworth	   3	210	70.0
Minardi	           0	 30	   -

Budget figures from here. Lowest guess value for Minardi taken. Constructors points from here.

Now Minardi haven't scored a point, so no return for their investment. However even if we given they score one point this weekend then it is still 30m per point. Worse than all, but Toyota and Jaguar Racing.

[BootsOntheSide]

Originally posted by courageous
Pound for Pound (£ that is, not lb) Minardi is the best team out there. Recently, they have had a good run of luck in finding drivers (Trulli, Fisichella, Alonso, Webber, Wilson); this year there was really no outstanding rookies with money - in a year or 2 it will be a different matter with a lot of sons of champions coming through the ranks, they should be able to pick somebody up - but again it will still see them well in the bottom half.
Still, the number of teams that have crumbled since Minardi started makes them champions for just surviving.

I'd go along with this. 2004 seems to just be a particualrly bad year for them, made worse by the point-scoring successes of Jordan and Jagaur, as well as Toyota's apparent (but embarassingly slow considering their budget) progress. In recent races Zsolt has outpaced Bruni, which doesn't say much for Gimmi's talent, even though Zsolt now appears to have got the hang of F1 insofar as he can.

[Dani Filth]

best investment for Minardi would be a Ferrari engine . like in the early 90's .. but the money ?? . can't see it happening ..
question .. could Sauber resell their Petronas engines ?? .. those units .. if can be rebiuld i think could be better then Cosworth .they get now ..

[Adam43]

Its not a simple case of reselling Petronas engines. There are teh rights to use them, the auxillery systems to use them and the re-builds. All of which require Ferrari to agree. Although I suspect if this had any chance of happening it would be a deal that revolved around some very old spec. engines.

[Dani Filth]

well . Sauber is gonna get better engines next year . so this years engines could go to Minardi . at a not that "high" price . and that got to be better then those engines used by Jordan ..

[Kicking-back]

Prost had Ferrari engines for a while - and it didn't do them much good.

[Dani Filth]

they had the best performance since switching from Mugen to Peugeot .. . and in those days . Ferrari engines were not as good as they are now compared to the cosworth ..

[Knowlesy]

Prost made appalling use of Ferrari engines in 2001......there's more to F1 cars than an engine.

[Dani Filth]

we all know that . but it could be better then their current units

[cds_uk]

Does anyone know how much Minardi is paying for the Cossies in relation to Jordan and the Fords. Also is there really a feasable way to get hold of another engine, they could go for Briscoe or Zonta but do Toyota want to supply a customer engine until they get there own house in order, mind you with MG pulling the strings now surely its sooner rather than later, i still think a link up with Renault is the best bet, get Montagny or Salignon on board and see what happens, mind you Jordan could get another engine deal and Minardi could get there hands on some half decent Fords yet, also i think Minardi need a totally new approach on the drawing board, why didn`t PS get Sergio Rinland when Arrows went under, nice tidy car with a cossie engine on a shoe string budget, seems like a plan to me.

[mountainstar]

Minardi's best hope is to be a second string team for toyota or renault or one of the other factories. There is really no other way forward.

[Kicking-back]

True.