Marshalling numbers

[james baggie]

I know people often moan about the low numbers of cars on grids, but what about the low number of marshals on the bank? At Rockingham this weekend (9/10 October) there was about one marshal per post and not all posts were manned. In my opinion this is the wrong way to marshal at a meeting, as the one marshal has to act as observer, flag and incident all at the same time. Thats a lot of work
What do other people think?

[MagnetON]

There's very much an "instant gratification" problem these days. Many people don't want to put effort into getting enjoyment. For some this means sitting at home and watching motorsport on the TV rather than participating. The increased coverage these days also allows people to see much more clubmans level racing than ever before.

End of season... As the season progresses there's a high level of burnout sets in. Also all the little problems like painting the shed, talking to the wife, finding out the names of the small adults that float around the house, that kind of thing.

Too many dates... The calendar is FULL to the brim, especially in the UK where there will be between several and MANY events on the same weekend. Marshals get selective and decide what classes they are going to do.

Bad Treatment... If your marshalling club or event organising club treats you bad you remember it and you cherry pick the events you're going to do. Marshals have long and short memories, treat us bad once and we WILL remember it... sometimes forever

Weather... Rain = Duvet Emergency ('nuf said!)

Take your pick

[Andrew Gunnell]

I think you will find that Silverstone, Donington and Mallory had meetings on over the weekend. So it would be interesting see how many marshals were at those events too. I think the only answer is to not have meeting at all the circuits in the midlands over the some weekend. Instead have two are possiblily three meeting over a weekend at a time.

[bodyrepairs]

I am not 100% certain but i think snetterton had 90ish on sat and 110 ish on sunday. A lot of those specifically were there because it was 750mc.

[james baggie]

If there had of been an incident at rockingham, then what would have happened? If there is only one per post and several with no one on, then it could end up being a bad situation as no one is able to attend. If numbers are that low, then shouldn't someone cancel the meeting due to safety aspects.

[MagnetON]

Originally posted by james baggie
If numbers are that low, then shouldn't someone cancel the meeting due to safety aspects.

The MSA steward has absolute power to stop the meeting if they feel it is not safe. If the steward is happy that single marshals can flag/stop and that incidents will be dealt with my turning out the rescue crew or stopping the sessions then that's their discretion.

[petestenning]

I think you will find that there are several reasons why 750 Motor Club can pull if thats the right word more Marshals,

1) Decent races and full grid most of the time.
2) Friendly atmoshere most important,
3) Very marshal adaptable ie will bend for certain times when people want to be together,
4) Thank you letters after meeting letting you know about the incident and the state of drivers from incidents,

There may be other reasons let us know why you marashal for us.

We are lucky to have such no s, but even we can be stretched by low numbers some times.

Pete

[mark ch]

I was due to marshal this meeeting for saturday ono... unfortunely it seems the tickets arrived on friday.... but friday i wasn't home as had made other arrangements... if tickets are that late don't be surprised if marshals have made other arrangements..

with the uniroyale beetles on the sunday... even early tickets and a hundred quid won't drag me to the circuit for the sunday

[EvilPumpkin]

It's perfectly possible to safely run a circuit with one marshal per post provided you have enough rescue to deal with incidents. We've had to do it on a number of occasions.

In terms of safety, I think you'll find the bottom line is that if you have adequate flag posts, that's all that's required.

I don't necessarily agree with it, but I've yet to hear of any circuit event that was cancelled on the day due to lack of marshals (although I probably will now!)

But it really does depend on the event, the location and the clubs involved.

For instance, I had to work on Saturday morning. But I then made my way out to Mondello to do the rest of the day because it was a BRDA RallyX. Why? Cos I love 'em! I also did Sunday. I'm pretty tired today but it was well worth it.

There are a lot of events that I wouldn't even consider doing that for.

[Ian Sowman]

Rockingham does have a couple or more fast response safety vehicles that can deal with incidents, and these were called into action during the UTC race yesterday.

I actually really enjoyed the first hour of the Beetles. Then we had another four

[Fireblade]

Originally posted by Ian Sowman
I actually really enjoyed the first hour of the Beetles. Then we had another four

And in one fell swoop Mr Sowman answers the original posters question.
I wouldn't put my slippers on to watch them in my back garden.

[Ian Sowman]

I don't think I did answer the question. The marshalling numbers issue is a wider one particularly, it would seem, at Rockingham.

[chezza]

UTC has dispensation to run with less marshals so thats probably what has happened here.

[SCARY]

I WOULD IMAGINE THAT THE LOW NUMBERS AT ROCKINGHAM WERE A COMBINATION OF -

1 IT BEING A FIVE HOUR BEETLE RACE (I WAS UNFORTUNATE TO MARHSAL AT TWO OF THESE A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO - WOULD NOT WILLING DO ANOTHER ONE). THESE RACES ARE GREAT FUN FOR THE DRIVERS, BUT TOTALLY MIND NUMBING FOR THE MARSHAL'S, ESPECIALLY IF THERE ARE ONLY 12 CARS ON THE GRID AS IN THE FIRST ONE I DID AT ROCKINGHAM.

2 GOOD MEETINGS LOCALLY TO ROCKINGHAM I.E. SILVERSTONE, DONINGTON AND MALLORY. NOT FORGETTING THE 750 CLUB AT SNETTERON (WHICH EVERY MARSHAL WITHIN A 100 MILE RADIUS WILL ATTEND)

IT'S LONG OVERDUE THAT THE MSA AND ORGANISING CLUBS GET TOGETHER AND REDUCE THE NUMBER OF CHAMPIONSHIPS AND INCREASE THE GRIDS.

[Woolley]

Wooh, Scary, don't shout! Quite correct, though. There were three meetings within a hundred miles appealing for marshals on this site alone - Mallory, Donington and Rockingham. Plus marshal-friendly 750MC at Silverstone will always take the lion's share simply because we all feel welcome by them.

The only way this is going to change is if the governing body start to govern and refuse to issue permits for too many circuits close together. Along with all the other 'being nice to the people in orange' ideas that have been repeated over and again on this site and elsewhere.

It seems likely that no-one will cancel meetings for marshal shortages except under very extreme circumstances, perhaps if the drivers feel it's not safe and withdrew, demanding their entries back? We marshals don't like the situation any more than you do.

[Alan Green]

In my opinion, Rockingham is still in it's early days and many marshals still haven't tried it, whereas circuits such as Donington, Silverstone, Mallory, etc, etc, have been around for many years (insert 'so have some of the marshals' gag here), and each circuit has their own core of marshals. Rockingham is still developing this, but it's on it's way.

Thankfully, due to the nature of the circuit and it's banked bits, there will always be a need for the [fast response] safety crews for the areas that we can't get to from trackside (either inside or outside the fence). On the road course(s) this does mean that the post manning will be lower numbers, but the available safety response levels are still there, and due to the multiple track formations will be able to get to most points quicker than at many other circuits.

And for anyone whos not been yet, have a look at at least one meeting there next year, it's an eye-opener (especially the Days of Thunder [Ascar] - I'm well and truly hooked into that series next season).

Al.

[mad racer]

nice day at mallory on sunday cood race bit cold to wards the end on assemably &pits firts time at the track got there nice early to find the way could with some more lights on the track at night like the black hole of calcutter

[Stuart Hill]

Originally posted by james baggie
What do other people think?

I "think" that I want to enjoy my hobby. therefore....

as mentioned in other threads....

"I will pick-and-choose where and when I marshal".

So what, I hear you ask, makes me choose one event over another?

Well, here are my reasons to do, or NOT do, any particular meeting...... in absolutely no particular order...


What's competing....?
Who's running it....?
Curfew..............?
Social side.........?
Camping amenities...?
Marshal's amenities.?
My friends going....?
Location............?


The number of positive answers to the above decides it for me. Nothing more, Nothing less!!

ie, am I going to enjoy my day/weekend or not?

[Stephen Green]

There is also the problem of too many two day meetings and this affects the numbers of marshals who turn up. For instance down here in the murky south (sarf to our east ender cousins) we have just had 5 two day weekend races on the trot, with another next weekend. It is totally unreasonable to expect the same marshals to turn up weekend after weekend both Saturday and Sunday. Whether you have a family or are single, there are still jobs that need doing at the weekend and you simply can't put them off for 6 weeks!

Will someone out there please listen to reason!!!!!!!

[Gridlock]

I was at the Caterham festival at Brands Hatch 9/10 which was not well supported by marshals. I attended on Saturday and again found the only place to camp was on Racing Green with no facilities. I was therefore not going to stay. However due to the low numbers I did stay and today contacted JP's Office. I got and immediate response from his staff who are again looking into the situation. I have no doubt that action will be taken and next season hopefully there will be a better understanding of marshals needs.

To consider the Rockingham situation I believe Rockingham is the most "Marshal Unfiendly Circuit" so no wonder they dont get the support.
A bus ride to sign on unles you want to take a long walk with your kit. Catering only from a high priced catering caravan. No easy access to toilets. Finally the camping facilities are terrible. On this last point I did write to the circuit owners who failed to respond. The last two meetings I attended at Rockingham I was on a post alone and many posts were manned by drivers. Of all the circuits Rockingham management need to pay a little more attention to the marshals otherwise they will deserve to have meetings cancelled.
Unless there is some major improvements for marshals at Rockingham I will avoid attending next year and certainly will not attend two day meetings.

[Clive]

Gridlock, why single out Rocky, a lot of circuits leave much to be desired for the wellbeing of marshals, to some it appears we are a necessary evil, at least that's how they make us feel. Several clubs are very cliquey as well. Rocky is different in that it is an oval, so by its nature access to the centre is restricted, but at least you do get a bus to take you, and around the circuit too. try that at Sliverstone or brands or mallory etc. All circuits could and damn well should improve facilities for the volunteers who they say they cant run racing without - increasing low numbers (or should that be decreasing????) bear testament to us beng fed up with it. the number of meetings etc also plays a part.

[Gridlock]

Clive
Yes there is always room for improvement. However as its the latest circuit Rockingham needs to do a lot more for marshals. Especially if they want to attract marshals for more than one day.

[bluebeard]

another reason for 750's good support, us marshals are always made to feel a welcome and vital part of the proceedings, unlike as previously stated, a "necessary evil". keep up the good work & good meetings 750's

[Grahame West]

I've done a few meetings this year where only 1-2 marshals were on a post but at each of those events it was made clear and expected that if it was a problem that couldn't be dealt with easily a race stop could be requested.

Series co-ordinators, circuit owners/operators and clubs all have a role to play in my humble opinion.

They MUST proactively look after marshals, especially those dedicated regulars who turn up event after event at their preferred/local motorsport venue.

[DougK]

I have just done my first meeting for two years - it appears nothing has changed - relatively small grids,lack of facilities and long days!. Organisers could be more Marshal (and competitor) friendly by merging races where grids are small. The bigger clubs (BRSCC,BRDC and BARC) need to work together and merge their championships so we get full grids - what fun is to anyone to have just 7 or 8 cars in a race? By working together the number of meetings can be cut down allowing more marshals to be available.